Might as well get a discussion going on Mink too. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Good or bad about him or his sons? Things you have seen or "heard"?

I have 4 females with lines to Mink. 1 granddaughter through Arko Parkstrasse, 1 great granddaughter through Citty Haus Ming (Iko Lindenhalle X Jenni Lindenhalle) and 2 great granddaughters whose dam is by Lewis.

I've got a 13 mo Mink g-daught. Her sire is a Mink son, grand dam is Haus Antverpa, the pup's dam is Czech. Two of my friends have pups from the same litter. This bitch pup is very nervy, super trainable in obed, nice ball drive, but she falls apart in strange situations, tho she does recover. The pups were quasi rescues. Her male littermate is much bolder and more confident, but not a lot of drive there either,tho he's a social butterfly, her sister is about the same, but not as animated. My bitch pup startles easily but recovers quickly, she's become very social. Super smart pup, it's a shame she's really limited by her nerves in what she could do. All the pups in the litter were solid blacks.

Lisa, I have three Mink females. I have just bred two of them, one whelped and the pups seem nice. Iko Lindenhalle is my bitches grandfather. Two are solid blk, and one is a super bitch, the others are very nice,in temperment and drive, except one does not have the bone that I like. Nice hips on all.
I know the the Citty dog you speak about. Did you get the pups from Frans?
Mink, I think he is going to be known as one of the great one's in years to come. He produces solid, tough dogs from what I have seen on a whole. and his progeny can pass this on.

No, I got her inderectly from Rick Burgos who now owns Citty. She is by Rick's Harro v. Sickenger Moorwerk and was from the 2000 breeding Rick did with Citty and Harro. Her prelims look excellent and I love her type. She too could have a bit more bone. Drives are very high, no dog aggression, naturally full calm grips and she is civil (something I happen to like as does my helper). Not a dog for most people (she and I have had SEVERAL discussions about who is Alpha), but I am enjoying her.

I've had a lot of experience with Mink sons and grandsons. In fact we had Lewis Malatesta's littermate Lando malatesta SchHI DPOI on our department (amazingly his hips were only so so).
What I can say is this, little heads, strong prey, fight drive all over the board from high to low, some significant problems with handler aggression (get a handle on this early) and the dogs really work to stay in prey (causing some control issues). Some have significant problems with environments like slick floors and others seem unaffected by anything. Hips seem to run better than average. The dogs have lousy stops.
Drive levels run high for most.

I wonder whether it matters from which dog you get Mink in the pedigree? E.g. Jago/Iko Lindenhalle, Lewis Malatesta, Crok Erlenbusch? Did these studs not produce quite differently?

The lack of bone seems to come out from time to time woih this line. An intresting point that Ed Frawley had with fine ones and nervy dogs; the bitch that I have that is not the best boned dog is a bit nervy in the protetion, a bit sharp, but overall is a good nitch. One thing they all have in common is that they are all a bit civil, but are stable animals. One of them will bite you if you are unfair to her: I like this bitch.

A dutch kennel called Haus Ming did some 2-2 breedings on mink so it would be interesting to see what these breedings produced. There is one tough west german dog in the states called Ron VH Bernhart mader ( a fax son) and he was WUSV and was known in Slovakia for producing VERY hard and tough police type dogs. It amazes me that he has had such little breedings. He had the best possible Bonatice 5/55.

Originally posted by chris j:
A dutch kennel called Haus Ming did some 2-2 breedings on mink so it would be interesting to see what these breedings produced. There is one tough west german dog in the states called Ron VH Bernhart mader ( a fax son) and he was WUSV and was known in Slovakia for producing VERY hard and tough police type dogs. It amazes me that he has had such little breedings. He had the best possible Bonatice 5/55.


Interesting that this dog you mention goes back to the same lines from which dogs like Mutz peltzeirfarm and Johnny Rheinhealle, and Natz Arolzer Holz came from.

I do believe that the future of working GSD's will show that Mink is an important piece of the puzzle in breeding working dogs.

After breeding over 260 270 litters of working bloodline GSD's I would advise any new breeder to stop looking for the panacea of stud dogs - there is no such dog and there NEVER will be.

Mink is important in the scheme of thinkgs. I currently have a 2-2 line breeding of my stud dog Otis (Otis is a Mink son and has more fight than any dog I have ever owned. But if you breed this dog wrong you are going to ahve more problems than the average person can deal with. Trust me I know, probably more than anyone in this country.

Otis has bred some really nice dog and some really scarry dogs. I always come back to telling people that breeding is like making bread - sometimes it's great sometimes the bread doesn't rise and you step back and wonder why went wrong.

Mink can produce great dogs, nervy dogs, tough dogs, rank dogs, high drive dogs and dogs that you would rather sneak over the hill and shoot in the head.

So would it be nice to say that Mink is the next best thing to Burn Lierburg - yes - but he is not. Time will show that he is a better stud dog to have in a pedigree than Hero, or Fero or Troll or Timmy or every show dog that every lived. But he is a long way from perfect.

I think the interesting challenge for all of us who breed Mink in our working dogs is to try and figure how best to combine the Mink line with other lines to deal with better grips, less rank and less independance.

The older I get the less I like a dog that bites me !!!!