Click Click Down Jason Down, Click Click good boy LOL <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Seriously though, what's wrong with good old fashion praise.

Jason,

Whats wrong with almost anything that works? If people can get the job done with a clicker, the job is still done. Everybody has a prefrence that works for them, any time some one actually gets the dog trained for obedience it is a boon to the entire dog owning public. If it takes standing on their head to get the dog trained, why not? No one will force you to use it.

I'll admit that I really don't know anything about clicker training. I agree though, whatever works man.

Questions.
Do you at some point stop using it?
Or do you need to hold this thing in your hand every time your praising, for the life of your dog. If your goal is to eventually wean them of it, then why start with it in the first place?

Jason, think of the clicker just as you would using food for training. Actually, if I'm not mistaken, you do use food WITH the clicker to initiate the positive association to the dog. At some point you have to wean the clicker, just as you would wean the food. I've never used it myself, and really have to desire to, but some people swear by it. I think the benefits of it are limited, though, especially when you get into advanced training and precision.

The clicker is a teaching tool. Once the dog is reliable in a behavior, you wean the clicker and the food and substitute praise only. Different trainers use it differently, depending upon their training philosophy. Some clicker trainers don't use it to teach commands, but rather, to reinforce desireable behaviors so that the dog will naturally begin to perform these behaviors automatically. Some clicker trainers use them to teach commands. Many assistance dogs are trained with clickers, as clicker training makes target training much easier. The idea is to shape behavior, so that you start by clicking when the dog gets the basic idea, then gradually click only for more and more refined and precise behaviors. Like any training tool, it can be used improperly, or it can be used with great success. I always maintain that your MIND is the ultimate training tool, and that if you know what you are doing (which takes years of trial and error) you can use just about any training tool, including the clicker, successfully. Any training device in the hands of amateurs can be used wrong. I think that when done properly, clicker training does no damage to the dog/handler relationship. It is merely a communication tool.

I like clicker training for one purpose. The closer the praise is to the response the better the association is. Many times a new trainer has trouble praising at the right time. With a clicker a second handler can give the praise while the dog thinks it is coming from the handler. Just like with a shock collar. Someone else can hold the controller.

The clicker is a tool, no more or less. For certain things and with certain dogs it works great. For others, not so good.

The clicker itself acts as an "event marker"...that is, the "click" marks...and ends...the desired behavior. You must actually get the behaviour first,(as with using a treat over the nose to get the sit) then you add the command ("sit"). There is really very little difference in this type of training and more traditional "good boy" training except that the clicker can be used with more speed/precision by most average people. (The best trainers always have VERY fast hands...the rest of us are not so gifted)

The down side, of course is that there is no consequence for not performing the required behavior with the level of precision or speed we may require...or, for that matter, not performing it at all. Food is usually used as a reward, but the ball or other items may also be used.

Once the dog makes the connection between the click and the reward, the reward does not have to be instantaeous. In this respect the clicker acts as a "bridge" and you can require longer stays, etc. And yes, you do "fade" the clicker and vary the rewards so the dog never knows...in later stages...when or how much reward he will get.

For simple companion dog training, the clicker works about as well as anything else, especially for those who will not make effective corrections anyway. It also can work very well on some breeds such as terriers, that not only do not look to people as their "gods" but can also be hard as nails. These dogs may just shut down under harsh corrections.

The clicker is not some sort of magic, but it does not deserve the reputation that it has among some working dog trainers for being a tool of inneffective training. This comes from some of the "granola" crowd who have embraced it as the perfect non-force way to train...and trumpet it to the skies as being the solution to everything from untrained mules to ill-behaved roosters...LOL.

Try and train a serious dog with serious drives with only a clicker and no compulsion and you are headed for failure...and quite possibly the Emergency room. There is a reason you see mostly poodles/goldens/bichons, etc. on clicker videos.

Vince, that's true. For many handlers, timing is a tough concept at first. Clicker training can certainly help the "timing challenged". An analogy that I read recently compares the click to the shutter on the camera; it allows you to isolate that split second, like taking a picture of the moment. It has the same effect as a well-timed "YES!" or "GOOD!".

Well said, Ikor. "Granola" crowd...that's a good one! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />