Hey Lady kill your dog” is a BS answer because you and I know it will not be taken to heart. Sooo... what is the best workable answer for a poster?

Containment. Who gives a rat’s _$$ if people own fear chomping spooks as long as they know what they own and have it the public's reach at all times?

Realist answer vs. a tough answer as far as forum answer goes.

No one in his or her right or even wrong mind would heed a post where not one person has even seen the dog.

Anyone think so?

Hey Lady kill your dog” is a BS answer because you and I know it will not be taken to heart. Sooo... what is the best workable answer for a poster?

Containment.

Who gives a rat’s _$$ if people own fear chomping spooks as long as they know what they own and have it OUT OF the publics reach at all times?

Realist answer vs. a tough answer as far as forum answers go.

No one in his or her right or even wrong mind would heed a post where not one person has even seen the dog.

Anyone think so?

 Quote:

Originally posted by Dennis Hasley:
"Hey Lady kill your dog” is a BS answer because you and I know it will not be taken to heart. Sooo... what is the best workable answer for a poster?

Containment.

Who gives a rat’s _$$ if people own fear chomping spooks as long as they know what they own and have it OUT OF the publics reach at all times?

Realist answer vs. a "tough" answer as far as forum answers go.

No one in his or her right or even wrong mind would heed a post where not one person has even seen the dog.

Anyone think so?

Well then why have a discussion board.

I did not hear anyone say right away "Hey lady kill your dog".

As far as who give a crap if people own these kind of dogs, I say I do and a whole lot of other people should care as long as the owner displays the same in-ability time and time again to fix a problem. Either the dog is too much for the owner, the owner to stupid or a combination of both. Then people start getting bit...then it's only a matter of time before a kid gets mauled. I am not just picking on Linda. Remember.....when people who have been training dogs their whole lives and some make a good living doing so, their advice is from experience. A person can either disagree, or take the advice and run. But when someone gets pissed because it is not what they want to hear and they develop an attitude problem, that tells me they really aren't looking for help, they are looking to validate what they have done. So why bother?

Can someone bring me up to speed on this thread.

I hate when I hear the blanket "Kill Em" routine.

To kill is final and without other options looked at and I can not tell from the lack of info here if other options have been looked at.

Perhaps I am not understanding the tone of the topic.

Jerry

Hi Jerry,

I think this topic is a continuation of this one http://www.leerburg.com/ubb//ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=131;t=000011

Chuck I do agree with you and the ridiculous post heading was to place a fine point on an answer that I doubt ever would be considered. Now consider this the debate roles out again like it did against this woman on another post and maybe she never hears the other side of real options. Assuming most would not run down to the vet the next day to put their dog down. They would be faced with several actions most of which could exacerbate the problem. Some of these actions would include public interaction in an attempt to deal with a problem it seems they are having a difficult time in controlling.

As far as I know, not one of us knows this woman or her dog or the extent of the problem. Even if the past history lends indications that the owner is incompetent, I don’t see the advantage of ripping them with answers and advice that will never be taken. You may as well tell her to place a cape on her dog and that is the best way to get the dog to fly on the 2nd full moon of the year and flying dogs don’t bite.

If we are talking about Linda. Dennis, go read her posts. All of them. If we are talking in general...I have an issue. Big surprise.

I don't and never will tailor my advice to a person because I think they won't listen to the other option. I have to wonder about someone who knows in their heart the right thing to do, and tells someone else to do something else becaue it 'fits' the situation.

If I believe someone should not own a dog...I will tell them. I don't care what theior reaction might be. It is not my job to protect their feelings. My job is to do the best I can training dogs(which is really training owners if you get down to it). While doing this I have an obligation to myself(who I hold more accountable than any organization) and to society not to be letting dogs I know are dangerous go out into public. When an owner shows that much stupidity, something drastic has to be done. Yes, the dog has to pay the price. However, so did everyone else who ever came into contact with that dog. When it comes down to it...uh oh...here they come...when it comes down to it...it is a DOG not a human.

Dennis and I are having a give and take in PM's over this subject. We disagree, I think mainly over the severity of the subject. Here's my 2 cents worth.

I really do tell folks to " kill their dogs". I tell about 3 a week to do this in fact. I am about the last person people call in my area when they have a really bad dog. If you call the police department with a bad dog question, you get my name. Same from about ten local vets and 3 county animal shelters, plus animal control from 4 suburbs. I see literally the worst of the worst. And I do save some of them. But not many.

I have been asked in the past by another trainer, "who cares if they own a fear biting spook as long as it doesn't go out in public. I don't care and neither should you". If that was the truth, I *wouldn't* care. But it is almost never the truth. For some reason, people that own these type dogs do not have a great grasp in reality, I see. These owners do not watch their dogs as they should. Linda from the previous posts is a good example. And it is always another person that suffers, rarely the dog owner themseves.

If a dog owner will not follow good advice, I'm done with them. I give them a written evaluation of their dog, my advice, and have them sign it - it protects me in the future. Why have a client that does not follow good advice? I see some trainers in my area have to work with noncompliant pet owners to insure they can put food on their tables. These trainers have to make a compromise. I won't. It's either the best way I know how, or they can go elsewhere. And when they go elsewhere, I read about their dog biting someone in the newspapers. I am even involved as a witness in a dog mauling case here in my county with a former student - I guess you can call him a student. We had 1 lesson, and I didn't charge him for it- it was obvious the dog was way too much for the man and yep, I told him to put it down. He didn't. And one of his daugther's friend got over 75 facial sutures. A totally preventable accident - crap, it's not an accident, it's carelessness!!

So this is where I am coming from. I don't care if my advice won't be taken to heart in a situation like this - it's still the right advice. I'm not looking for the best "workable" answer - I'm looking for the best answer *period*. I provide a service- if the client doesn't want the service, I'm fine with that. I've got a long waiting list for students now.

And I think the tough answer in this case was the realistic one. And I tell owners to their face that they should not own dogs, if they're that type of person. I'm not looking for praise and good PR, I'm looking for good results.

Will, sounds like a pr piece for my training...lol

I never have worried about what the other person 'thinks'. It is not my job. I give (I guess that would be gave now...lol) a free evaluation. I told people up front in the evaluation the purpose of this eval is for me to try and scare you away. If you come back I know you are serious. It is almost like a fad for people to say how many trainers they went through. Or how many classes 'buster' has flunked. I guess I must have got through to a few. I had on the hottest weekend of the year last year...30 clients come out and help me build fences. Gave up their whole weekend to help. About 20 of them came back the next weekend. So for every one 'Linda' I have a whole bunch more who are thankful and to the point gracious.

Whats more, I don't have to worry when I go to sleep at night, that I compromised my principals so I didn't offend someone.

I think that most of us here can say that we would not want to be living next to anyone with a dog that must be kept totally in secluded.
Mistakes happen and most dogs are escape artists, and there is absolutely no way to guarantee that the dog in question will not get loose and attack my kids, or any others.
As a trainer do you not have a responsibility to protect innocent children from animals that are so uncontrollable and unfixable.
If you read my posts my son was just attacked by a chow in the middle of the road.Thank god he was not hurt, but I got the same crap from the owners saying that he was just a little overprotective, and it was an accident that it happened.
My son was totally innocent and did not deserve what happened to him.It was an accident that the dog got out, but it always is, this is the 2 time that it has attacked.
Owners that own these types of dogs need the cold, harsh truth. They need pics of mauled kids thrown in their faces and they need to be asked if that is what they want to be responsible for.