Ok folks lets see how creative you are? We have a dog that is real defensive, he always has real frontal bites alot of growling and very weary of a stick. He is also a typewriter biter on send aways. The dog is a German Shep that is a dual purpose police dog and is 5 years old. So I had the handler tie back the dog and had him with the dog and I came in in a prey fashion and gave the dog a bite. The dog got a full mouth bite but still alot of growling, so I pulled the dog to the end of the tie back to make sure he was going to hold on and then let him rebuild and counter and slipped the sleeve. Then I had the handler go to the side of the dog, I wanted to see the dogs mood, and did the same thing. The dog agian had a very frontal bite. So I pulled him to the end of the line and see if the dog would rebuild and counter but he didnt. So The sleeve slipped out of his mouth and I ran away. I figured we could do the exercise and gradually have the handler move away. Anyone else has any ideas or comments? I thought about using a bungee but I havent purchased one yet. Any opinions?

Thanks Austin

Hey Austin,

what i would try is very little helper movement calming dog right down.. when the dog bites does is hold or spit the sleeve?

Austin,

We had something similiar here - dog would bite (not full mouth), then simply spit it out. Very very low drive.

What ended up helping was useing a whip (as noise), agitated alot, and when the dog finally bit the wrap (on-leash bite, dog/decoy at end of leash), the handler acted as the back tie and simply pulled down with the taunt leash, so that the leash ran along the back of the dog...when the dog began inching inward on the wrap (to get a full mouths bite), we waited until he had the full mouth then slipped the sleeve.

After a few of these, the dog has a very full bite, and (incredibly) his drive is way up.

Austin a few comments. Re dogs that are wary of the stick. Keep in mind that he may have a problem that can’t be entirely fixed. He may have it forever. I’ve had some success in making this better by using a tree branch with a lot of leaves on it, in place of the stick. When the dog is on the bite, gently stroke him with it. Don’t threaten him with it until he fine with the stroking. Then alternate threatening and stroking. After a few days of this, strip a few leaves off the branch. Continue as above. Continue to strip off a few more leaves each day so that the branch slowly comes to resemble the stick.

As to the bungee, I hate them! You can’t tell if they’ve been damaged because you can’t see the rubber core. Even a brand new could have been stepped on over a sharp edge and it’s ready to break. If you decide to use one I’d suggest replacing it regularly, at least every year. Think of the shock absorbing capabilities of an old rubber band. It’s not all that big a deal if you’re wearing protective gear, but if you plan on doing any civil agitation look out!

I like to use a steel cable that’s encased in clear plastic. You can tell with a close inspection if any strands are broken, either in the length or at the fasteners. I like to double up on the snap bolts, in case one breaks. I fasten the cable to a chain link fence, midway between two posts. I thread a piece of 11mm mountain climbing rope through 5–6 strands of chain link mesh to spread out the force. The fence gives just enough to absorb the dog hitting the end of the cable. Be careful to avoid getting any kinks in it. If you do, replace it.

As to the other problems: Is there some reason that you’re keeping a dog that’s so defensive? Or is it one of those, where you don’t have a choice? There are ways to build up such a dog so that he looks good, but in a real fight, if he gets hurt, he’s liable to leave. If this is a sport dog, you can disregard this paragraph. But since it’s in this section, I’m guessing that it’s not a sport dog.

As far as the stick goes hes coming along very well. I did want to put this post in the K9 police section but there was a new post there and didnt want to bump it, just in case if anyone was wondering. We did some work with him today and he did ok along as the handler is by his side and the decoy isnt pumping him up. I think there is more of a mood problem here I could be wrong but it seems if he is in a calm mood then he does very well. I also was curious what he would do in the muzzle and needless to say he needs alot of work. I really didnt expect to much seeing how this was the first time in the muzzle, at least that I know of. I think this dog just needs alot more calmer atmosphere and then put the stress on later. But like I said I am open for any suggestions. Good idea about the branch I will remember that Lou.

Austin

Five years w/ problems on the grip? Well, I will put out a very simple approach to the problem which may or may not help.
Don't put too much emphasis on classic grip buiding training like the back tie.
Go out and do field work and develope the confidence in the dog under varying environments. Wind scenting where the dog barks the suspect into flight from his hiding spot, area searches where there is a barrier between the dog and suspect where the dog can indicate and have the suspect move rapidly along a fence raising drive prior to the occasional short and successful combat phase. Find buildings in which similiar training can be done. Keep it fast and furious using decoys seen running into the hiding areas. No long searches where the dog has time to settle into a routine of hunting, it needs to be still stimulated by prey drive from seeing the decoy run. Many fast repetitions.
Remember, this is a police dog and confidence is the name of the game. The frontal bites may never go away entirely, but focus on the work.