Hello, I have a question(s) about the raw diet. I've been thinking about starting my two dogs on this for quite awhile. I hope this is the proper forum for this question. I read Ed's article on Raw Diet and I've researched other websited on BARF diets, etc. Anyhow, this is what I was wondering: since the bones are an important part of the diet, but I am nervous about my dogs actually eating them, would it be OK to buy a whole chicken and have my butcher grind it up into burger, or is there a special reason for having the dogs actually eat the whole bones?
Would it hurt to feed Flint-River ranch kibble along with with a raw diet?
Are the vitamins that are added necessary if you feed a kibble that has vitamins in it already?
If so, are these vitamins the same as the vitamins, etc, that I can buy for myself?
Thanks in advance,
Janice Jarman

My dog won't eat chicken bones (or raw chicken for that matter) so people have told me to either buy bonemeal or have a butcher grind up a whole chicken for him. So yes you can do that if you like.

I haven't had time to go to a butcher yet, so I've still been giving my dog dry food for half of his meals to make sure he's not missing out on the calcium that comes from the bones.

I would add vitamins even to dry food, it goes the same for people - some people will say "I eat healthy, I don't need extra vitamins" - that's not true, vitamins should be added to any normal diet. Flax seed oil is awesome for human hair and a dog's coat alike, most people, and any dog that lives on a dry food diet will never get enough vitamin C in their system (3000-4000mg is a very reasonable daily dosage for humans, I give my dog 1500-2000mg a day). For example, Nutro Large Breed Puppy dry dog food is an excellent brand of dog food (IMO) with all human grade ingredients, however, their ingredients list doesn't even show how much Vit C the dog will get because I guarantee it's a tiny amount not even worth mentioning, and they say 160 IU of Vitamin E per KG of food! I give my dog 300-400 IU of Vitamin E DAILY. No way will he eat a 1kg a day of dry food to get less than 1/2 of what I give him myself.

I like to buy vitamins intended for dogs, "The Vitamin Shoppe" local to me carries some excellent multi-vitamin tablets for dogs that have chicken flavoring to make my dog more likely to eat it. The Multi-Vitamin tablets will suplement alot of useful things for your dog, but those tablets still don't contain enough Vit C or Vit E, and I still add glucosamine to my dog's food, as well as kelp/alfalfa/omega 3/flax seed oil.

Now, what's funny is, I hate taking vitamins, I can't stand swallowing pills, I do it but not nearly as often as I should - but I insist that my dog take them, just like I am sure I will insist my kids take them too some day <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Hope this answers some of your questions.

Are you worried that your dog will choke or is there something else you're concerned about? When I started feeding my dog bones I would freeze the whole meal in a baggy. Since everything was stuck together he had to gnaw at it rather than gulping. It would take him about 15 minutes to eat his food. I believe I read that idea on this site.

The bones also keep their teeth clean and white.

Thank you, Mike, for the info. I wasn't sure about the vitamins. I'll have to do some shopping around to find dog vitamins, though. I live in the country outside of a small Mid Missouri town. I think I'll print Ed's list from his feeding article and go do some shopping. What works for the big dogs ought to work for my little dogs.

Thanks for the response, Pam and Ted. Yes, I am worried about my dogs choking on the bones. I don't have large dogs anymore, I have two miniature pinschers. I do give them raw beef marrow bones with meat/gristle attached every other weekend and I don't worry about them, because the bones are pretty large. Those seem to help keep their teeth nice and clean, too. I was worried about one of them trying to gulp down a hunk of chicken or chicken bone and choking. Thanks again.

I have a poodle/brussels griffon mix who weighs about 6 pounds and I feed her the same things I feed my two rottweilers, just not quite as much <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

When I feed them chicken necks I cut them up for the small dog and feed them whole to the rotties. She has never had any problems eating the bones. Yesterday they got some chicken drummettes and she was able to eat a whole one without any problems (it just takes her longer). It was the rotties I had to watch to make sure they didn't inhale them and actually chewed them up.

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Thank you, Mike, for the info. I wasn't sure about the vitamins. I'll have to do some shopping around to find dog vitamins, though. I live in the country outside of a small Mid Missouri town. I think I'll print Ed's list from his feeding article and go do some shopping. What works for the big dogs ought to work for my little dogs.

If you can't find it locally... I order most of the vitamins from Leerburg.com, but since he doesn't sell Vit E and the vit's that I was already using, I get those from The Vitamine Shoppe. The stuff from Leerburg is in large pots so lasts quite a while.

Just curious, is there a known issue with giving dogs human multi-vitamins?

I dunno, I buy the stuff for dogs because it exists and the Super C 2000 that Leerburg sells is double the concentration of what my local store sells, so its the same price, the same quantity, but I only need to give my dog half the amount for the same quantity of Vit C, so technically its 1/2 price. I give my dog human Vit E though because I can't find "dog Vit E", IMO its all the same, but for some reason, I believe its my Salmon Oil Omega 3 that says "Not for humans" or something to that effect on it, don't know why though.

I'd like to get someone elses input on this, perhaps Ed could jump in?