I've had my Beauceron pup for some months now, and couldn't resist mentioning how he's doing, even at this early age (7 months).

I didn't work him much at all until he was done teething. At age 6 1/2 months, the first time he saw a sleeve on a decoy he went for it at full blast, and got a deep bite. He loves bitework, and at seven months is doing bites at a distance from the handler, is starting on the hard sleeve, does not care about clatter sticks and whips, and is enjoying himself immensely. He is very drivey. (He's very protective too. I got him at twelve weeks; at fourteen weeks he would very boldly run up to strangers on the property and bark at 'em. I'm going to have my hands full....)

Structurally, he is very good, and very athletic. He's happy and social, though too energetic to play with small children. At seven months, he weighs between fifty and sixty pounds and has long, gangly legs, which he will have to grow into. He's a very happy camper, and a handsome dog. Me too (the "happy camper" part).

And he came out of show lines! (When his drives became evident to his breeder, she decided he would need a working home.)

This particular puppy had been recommended to me by a breeder in the Netherlands, who owned the sire. I bought the pup from Dominique Hubert at Diable de Morval kennels, and she was a jewel. Lots of great follow-up. I would definitely recommend her as someone you can trust.

Many recommend caution in buying a Beauce for protection sports, and I would have to join in; I have heard a lot of bad stories. There are often problems with nerve and structure. Defense drive, as a rule, is very strong, prey very low. They "take offense" easily, and a full grown working Beauce, if hit or too severely corrected by his owner, might bite or attack.

Private mail me for further info on the breed, if you wish. I'll try to post a picture. His kennel name's Dandy Dandy and his call name is Cadejo. (A cadejo, in Mayan culture, is a mythical dog which protects "trasnochadores"-- those who walk around at night. Or else attacks them; there are good and bad Cadejos. El Cadejo sounds near when he is far away, and far away when he is nearby. When he walks, his paws make a sound like bones breaking. A priest in 1751 wrote to Spain that the Mayans near his church would not go out at night, for fear of this dog, for whether good or bad, when you see him you feet freeze, your blood turns icy, and you cannot speak for weeks after.)

Hm. Will Rambeau might be interested. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Did you crop the ears and tail?

Actually I love them as a breed! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
Too bad that they're rare as hen's teeth here in the U.S. They're be a great potential for some enterprising European kennel master to import some good ones and get them in the hands of some willing SchH handlers ( or the reality based protection sports ) that might make a name for the breed here in the U.S.
I can always hope... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />


Wayne buddy, please....keep posting your impressions here in public. A lot of experienced dog trainers would love to hear about this, believe me!

I saw one a few years ago trained in SAR work. I felt it had to many nerve problems for the work.

Way way waaaaay back when I first was getting hooked on French Ring I researched a couple of Beauceron breeders just because. I knew that cost and logistics would prohibit my getting one in the near future but they are just so darned INTERESTING. The breeder that I did actually chat with was pretty much an ARBA show breeder, but very helpful (and I believe he had a dog of his breeding in a police department somewhere in the US.) I then had the opportunity to see one "do" bitework (not this same breeder, just coincidence) and unfortunately the experience sort of soured my opinion because the dog was a moronic bundle of nerves.

I still sit up and take notice whenever someone mentions the breed though, waiting (hoping) to see if someone will end up with one they can work with. The best of luck to you with your puppy- sounds like you are off to a very good start!

Thanks to all. Yes, nerve issues definitely can be a problem with this breed; but if you are willing to import, and (can't overemphasize this) take some time to develop an e mail relationship with some good, trustworthy European sources, I think you could find a remarkable protection prospect. (There are about a dozen Beauce breeders in the States, but health and nerve issues seem more prominent. It is extremely hard to find a healthy, working-prospect Beauce in the USA.)

These dogs rarely score high in Schutzhund and similar sports. I think there's general agreement that they are NOT high scoring sport dogs. But, as Mike Ellis told me, they're mighty fine dogs for a stroll down a dark alley.

On the cost: I imported from Belgium. This required:

1. buying the dog
2. paying transportation expenses for the breeder to make an overnight trip to the Netherlands from Belgium
3. buying a crate
4. dog hotel, one night
5. shipping on KLM

The total cost was comparable to what it would have been to purchase a dog from a US breeder and have it shipped to Los Angeles. (typical purchase price $1000-1300; shipping varies, but is pretty significant.)


Here's a link to a page which shows a number of Ring III Beauces, including Seneque, the 2004 reigning champion Beauceron. This is on the site of the breeder who sent me my dog.

Wayne,
Excellent and informative post!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

My Dept. has trained 3 Beaucerons , 1 for our Dept. and 2 for outside agencies . The 2 that went to outside agencies were pretty good if I remember right. This was about 7 years ago and before I became a trainer so I didn't work with all of them too much .

The only lame duck was the 1 we kept in our Dept.. I decoyed often for him and the best way to describe the dog was Bi-Polar . 1 minute he would hit me like a freight train and the next time he wouldn't hit all that hard . He could be confident on one call and nervous on the next for no identifiable reason . He showed alot of promise (great tracking dog and good commitment to a badguy when his head was on straight) but couldn't get over his nerve issue and was pulled off the street. He found and dealt with alot of badguys before that though .

Of these 3 I think they all were medium to high in defence and medium to high in prey . 1 was handler aggressive also .

The only thing I really don't like about the breed is that extra dew claw(I think it's a dew claw) they have .

I'm preparing my Beauceron for her B.H. She is sired by a herding lines stud and her dam is show lines.

The herding lines breeder of the sire (Michel Pillard: a French herding judge) seemed to select his outside blood from farms (earlier pedigrees) and later from ring lines to produce his champion herders.

I note that the link Mr. Stromberg provided shows the very predominant influence of Ce and Roi in the dogs with the most Ring decorated pedigrees.

I note that dogs with more of an outcross don't have as many Ring titled dogs in the pedigrees.

My Beauceron bitch is low in defence and medium in prey. Another working dog trainer with Beaucerons in the U.S. with similar lines to those in the link provided by Mr. Stromberg reports Beaucerons often being low in defence.

I translated an article by a person named Guy Courade, written about the working Beauceron in 1969, in which he confirms Mr. Stromberg's view.

I believe that a dominant beauceron male is indeed a forbidding and formidable and often highly defensive animal, but that many don't share these traits.

At times I can really get my girl on to a great high prey intensity, and lately have achieved much more consistency in this intensity. however then other times she is sniffing around the field thinking about anything but the toy.

The decoys so far, in early protection work, have been unable to get my Beauceron to bark.

I believe it will come, and I believe a high intensity, certainly more than many german show lines GSDs, is quite possible. She responds very favourable to stick and intimidation, so far (very early).

I compare her to my cattle dog who would crash plate glass for his ball on a string, anytime, anywhere.

My girl is tremendous around my 21 month old son although a highly "mobile" dog, is very dog social, friendly, and like many Beaucerons a bit "enervated" at times, I don't think the word "hectic" quite describes the rather unique Beauceron nervous energy that is typical of the breed.

I am sure that Beaucerons face the issues of many breeds with a relatively small working population in a larger breed: keeping the intense working ability without increasing the inbreed coefficient through the roof.

I don't know, but suspect that giant schnauzers, bouviers, briards face similar challenges.

rgds andrew may

I'd like to correct my previous impression of Courade's description describing a dog high in defence: I think it is more consistent with high prey drive. I'll let others form their own opinion. rgds andrew may