I'm asking your opinions because my judgement is clouded by "puppy love."

I don't know whether to euthanize a dog or give him another chance.

I took a 30 lb rott/chow mix out of a shelter. I was told that he was friendly and was not told about the chow mix. He had been in a shelter from 6 months old to 2.5 years old and was not at all socialized.

When I got him, he was extremely fearful - I had never seen anything like it! He was afraid of cars, collars, leashes, doors, chairs - everything! I worked with him to get him over the fears - he wasn't too bad (just dramatic) and it took about 1 week.

At the end of the week, I asked him to sit, which he did and he got treats - about 3 or 4 times in a row, the next time he bit me. The same thing the next day. I consider these both my fault because I was not in a stress/distraction free place - TV was on - and I was leaning forward slightly when he was sitting by the couch - so he probably felt cornered. Then I was dumb enough to do it again. My fault.

I kept working with him, had him neutered, housetraining, cratetraining, put him on a stress-reducing supplement called Composure. He stoped biting at my legs while being walked and learned a lot of ob and tricks. He was able to function rather normally actually and his personality came out - just the neatest, fastest learning, little dog I've had.

He went back to the rescue group that he came from on the theory that they could socialize him starting from his comfort level. Well, now we are trying to repossess him for breach of contract.

I've learned alot since then and I am confident to work with him. My plan would be to start him out on Clomiparamine (spelling?) for about a month. Then start groundwork by fasting him and ignoring him for 24 - 36 hours (using the crate, possible muzzle as well) to set him up for change of behavior. Then his next 2 meals would be 1/4 of his portion fed by hand. The next day, get the smell of a treat on my hand (before his meal) and work through a task - then when he performs it correctly he is rewarded with a full portion fed in his dish. Then continue with groundwork per Ed's article.

After 1 month, take him off clomiparamine and fast one day - to prepare him - and put him in a controlled stressful situation. When he begins to shut down, bring up the stressors until he learns that his fear responses will not make the stimuli go away. When he stops trying to shut down - he is a bright dog and I guess this will take him less than 5 minutes - then he is rewarded with food treats and the stopping of the stressful stimuli.

This would need to be repeated 30 (+) times (I was thinking twice a day for 15 days) then continue training and socializing as any other weak-nerved dog. If it doesn't work then I would consider the damage done as a puppy to much and have him euthanized.

Of course I am open to other training ideas - just PM me. I am mostly wondering if you think I should give the dog the chance or have him euthanized.

Anne,

My uneducated opinion is that that is a LOT of work to go through unless you had a specific plan in mind for the dog. And it seems even if you get through to this dog, the question mark will remain as to whether or not he will ever bite again.

Kudos to you for your compassion. It's extremely challenging to work with a dog that has this type of behavioral issues.

When a dog is afraid of both animate & inanimate objects they suffer from "global fear". This can often be difficult to overcome. In making a decision you would have to factor in what your goal is for the dog & your expectations if it's unable to meet that goal etc.

I just wanted to briefly share my ongoing experience with a rescue dog who suffers from global fear. I wasn't fully informed of the severity of her fears until after she was in my home (she came from another state). My regular vet wasn't able to help so I turned to the Behavioral Dept of a veterinary school/hospital. She went on daily clomiparamine with acepromazine to use only as needed if she was really wigging out. After 2 months without noticeable improvement she was changed to Prozac. She also has Xanax as needed. After 2 months on Prozac I noticed improvement but she's still fearful to a degree. Also, with the positive changes came negative ones i.e. she now shakes with fear when I interact with her where before I was the only one she trusted.

I am teetering with the thought of euthanasia because to me, it's a "quality of life" issue. We are quick to euthanise a dog who is suffering physically but IMO, a dog who lives in a constant state of fear is suffering. Like you, my biggest drawback is the tug of my heart strings.

Having said that, the daily challenge of dealing with a fearful dog can be emotionally draining. Despite well laid plans, these dogs are unpredictable. Then there is the cost of medication....Molly's Prozac runs $40/month.

Good luck. I hope it works out for you.

Dee

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She went on daily clomiparamine with acepromazine to use only as needed if she was really wigging out. After 2 months without noticeable improvement she was changed to Prozac. She also has Xanax as needed.

Your little one seems worse off than Tyson. When I last handled him in April, he only exhibited fear behavior when overstimulated - like if the TV and radio were on and I was talking. Then he exibited overexcitement then fear (then bite). He responded great to a time out - just stuck him in another room for a minute or two.

A photo of him http://www.petfinder.org/pet.cgi?action=...w=0&tmpl=&stat=

Stiff, tail low, straight neck, eyes glazed. The photos anger me and this post is the reason for repossessing. The information has been falsified. The listing and his confinement are both in breach of contract.

The thing is - there's no way to know if he'll bite again. I know I can work out his issues - I forgot to mention he was dominant to my husband - but I (personally) think that his little personality is worth it the risk that he could bite.

Anne,
I do agree with what Chris has mentioned. One month is not enough time for a rescue dog with a questionable history, even on meds. I do believe that some of the behaviors can be modified, but you will still be dealing with that existing temperment. You need to always be aware of what your dog is capable of and not put him in a situation to fail. I also have a rescue dog. She seems to have not been fully socialized and may have had some questionable handling before I got her. I will never let children near her, she has nipped at a small child. With that said, I believe that we also need to recognize their fears and help introduce them gradually to those "boogie monsters" Not make a big deal of it. They surely feed off of our tensions and anxieties.
I have taken my dog to a homeopathic vet, she is on raw diet, only received rabies vaccine. She is on 3 flower essences for her emotional issues. I have to say, she seems less spooky and more confident. Even my husband has noticed and commented, and believe me, he is skeptical. As he put it, she is having moments of "normalicy" She is not inclined to fully relax with him if I am not home. But that is beginning to change. I know she will never be a big goofy friendly dog. But I'm striving to help her become the best SHE can be. Continue to give your dog a chance!
Regards,
Linda

Then again, even though you are attatched for some reason, the time you spend on this disaster, you could train 10 rescues in basic OB and get them all good homes. I wouldn't waste my time on this one when there are many out there getting killed that would not think of biting anyone. If you are trying to help shelter dogs think numbers, not disasters. Don't mean to sound harsh, just every two weeks you spend with this disaster, a non-disaster goes to it's death. Plus who wants to own stuff like this? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

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Plus who wants to own stuff like this? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

Wow!

I've got to agree with Jeff on this one. The dog is an accident waiting to happen and all the drugs in the world aren't going to help him. There are dozens of dogs you could be helping in the time you are spending on this dog.
It isn't a question of if he will bite someone (besides the
owner) but when.
What kind of "rescue" group adopts out a dog with these issues or has a dog for two years and doesn't socialize him?
Sounds more like hoarding then rescue :-(

There are too many good dogs in rescue to spind time on this dog. You'd be doing him a favor by letting him go.
If he was in pain from cancer would you make him suffer or
let him go?

Thanks for the opinions!

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There are dozens of dogs you could be helping in the time you are spending on this dog.

And there are thousands of rescues. I only handled dogs with behavioral problems because a) it's usually handler error or lack of vet care and b) I've had good results. I only handled a couple animals a year and I'm leaning towards NEVER doing rescue again - too many stupid people in the world. If I were to take in this dog it isn't killing another dog.

This dog can never be adopted out. However, he's not in pain, he functions normally - just crate at signs of overexcitement. He has come so far for me to give up on him. Even if I have Ty euth, I would consider it a successful rescue because I was able to restore the quality of his life.

I'm seriously thinking about giving him a definite period of time - 6 months. And try the training. Because of when the overstimulation behavior started in relation to when the fear behavior stopped, I think it may have been my fault in not teaching him a positive outlet for his stress, so he learned another negative outlet.

It is an issue that can be managed as well. Crate when TV is on (which is rare), Crate at night, when gone and with visitors (also rare). Watch for overexcitement and crate or timeout - problem solved.

There is certainly no way any one else can handle him, nor would I ask or allow anyone to.

Because of the investigation (into the rescue I got him from), it will apparently be a long time before I find out if a) he will be released or held as evidence and then make a decision whether to have him euth or not. I'll have time to think on it.

His personality is such a gem. * sigh *