Hi, just looking for some advice or opinions on my new pup. I've got a 12wk old belgian malinois. He's from a very hard line of Mals and I'm working him in French Ring. He is my first Mal and there has been some new behavior that I'm curious about. A few examples of behavior:

#1 - After being introduced to the family on his first day home, I later introduced him to my 8mos old female GSD (she's a working dog as well) All was well until my Mal picked up something from the yard that he deemed a toy. When my female looked at him next he spat the toy and charged her. She reacted well, and just more or less avoided his attempts but didn't react aggressively in return. (she's 65 lbs and he's around 23lbs) I removed the toy from the equation and they sniffed and played again no problem. This behavior continues, but they only get limited time together (supervised by myself) and I'm not too worried about my girl, I feel the two of them will sort themeselves out. I expect the male to be the dominant dog around the house in time.

#2 - My father in law came over to see the new pup on his 3rd day with me. Again, all tail wags and attention seeking until my father in law picked up his ball and hid it behind his back. "Cruiser" then started growling and biting at my father in law. (mixed emotions here, after all, he is my father in law... LOL)

#3 - Just a few minutes ago I was working with him in the backyard and he became tangled up in his leash/harness (bad handler I know <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> He started growling and rolling around as the leash was wrapped around his legs. I went over and started to help him get "unwrapped" and he started growling again but this time I felt it was directed at me. At this point I grabbed the scruff of his neck and shook him pretty good while verbally shouting "no". This made him growl some more so I "brought it up a notch both verbally and with the scruff as well. He then yelped a bit and I untangled him and put him in his crate.

- he is crated if he's not with me, and if he's with me he's on a leash inside the house so I can keep an eye on him.
- he sleeps in his crate at night downstairs and isn't allowed upstairs.
- his first visit to the ring field and he was extremely social with the people there. He walked out onto the field like he owned the place and ears back wagging his tail madly whenever he approached someone from the club.
- he has extremely high prey drive
- he's very mouthy but I expect that and it's no problem.
- I can take anything I want from him without a fuss. If it's a toy, a brief game of tug and then a soft "done" and it's mine. He's got a kong that I let him keep, but I'm making sure he knows that the tug is my toy and he plays with it when I want him to. If he's eating I can pick up his bowl and he just sits down in his crate again until I put it back. (I don't make a habit of this, but I was just "testing the waters" after experiencing his level of dominance)

I guess I'm wondering if I've got a real problem on my hands because I haven't experienced this type of behavior from such a young dog before and I want to make sure that I do the right things now so I don't end up in a tougher situation as he ages. Any opinions or advice would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Grant

No problems there if You don't make it a problem <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
Good luck with your pup!

I would try and look at this dog as a working dog, not so much family dog for now. when he is having his little temper tantrum for being tangled up, I would ignore the tantrum and not try and physically dominate him. Leave him tangled until he can calm down. I have seen this with new Mal owners.(me) It is not a shepherd for sure! I think that a hard dominant puppy like that should be kept from non-working dog people for a bit till you get a bit more control and he has a better understanding of "rules". I still don't get the picking up the food thing. I see a lot of that here. You can make that whole dish thing a nightmare fairly quickly. Luckily he didn't care. As far as scruffing,remember that the earlier you begin correcting the harder that you will have to correct later, and I think that without some understanding of why the punishment is occuring with these types of dogs, they can take it personal, making more problems later. I had a dog like that.

Ok, everyone wants one of these tough high drive pups.Then they get the pup home and freak out because the little monster is hard to live with.
If you want a real working dog you better be ready for the intense drives that come with it.Its not fair to the pup to correct him or her so harshly for something that is neither good nor bad to the pup,just instinctual.Especially a Mal,they are VERY instinctual.
Just ignore the pup or redirect the behavior into a positive activity.Im not saying you cant ever correct,but a puppy has no idea of what is acceptable and what isnt.You need to show him.Be firm but fair.You must establish yourself as the leader,not the dictator from the start.
If not then get a lap dog.

Get the puppy DVD's I have produced:

How to Rasie a Working Puppy http://leerburg.com./117.htm and Your Puppy 8 Weeks to 8 Months http://leerburg.com/120.htm

You are making some subtle mistakes that are covbered in the DVD's

Also read the article I wrote on raising two puppies at one time - (an 8 month old dog is another puppy)

LOL! My first male was just like this and more - you have to accept that some of these dogs you just cannot live with, literally. Mine is a kennel dog thru and thru, we still have a great bond, but he is not one to hang in the house with, he is purely a working dog.

Although I agree (on the whole) with what has been said above regards corrections, something to think about.. I let my boy get away with such behaviors (the ones directed at me, not other people) in the early months, I tried to ignore it, tried to avoid situations that would spark it. I saw him as a baby (he was 5-6 mths at the time),and didn't correct him because of it .. and because of what is mentioned in the above posts. For me and that specific dog this was a mistake. I got to the point where I was very wary around the dog, didn't want to make sudden movements, did not want to play with him incase it got out of control. He laid into me REALLY good 3 times. One of the times my hubby had to choke him off my bare arm at 4 mths old (and all because I would not let him bite my jacket!), another of the times he got me on both arms and legs (I still bear the scars two years later).. and this time because I stopped throwing his a stick. Only after the 3rd time did my breeder (and hubby) tell me "Sort this out right now or sell the dog, or the dog will kill you when he is two years old". Next time he did it I flattened him within an inch of his life (and I about had a heart attack doing it LOL).. he was 6 mths or so old. He just had (has) VERY intense prey drive, that turns FAST to fight when he is challenged, crazy prey possesion.. with the added issue that he was VERY unclear when in drive at a younger age. Only now, at two is he starting to get clear in the head.

I am not suggesting you do this, just monitor the situation. I think there are very few dogs that are REALLY instense (or crazy/retarded.. however you want to look at it) It did not affect his drive or attitude in any way, shape or form, but it did give him a healthy respect for me, which now, two years down the line I am very grateful for.

Still to this day I have to be pretty careful with him sometimes. I am 99.9% sure he would not go after me again, but it affected me (which I hate!), I won't get real silly with him whilst playing with the tug, or try and get him super hyped up (he does that all by himself LOL) .. a little word of advice, get that "out" going NOW, motivationally of course.. it took me 3 solid months to get it going on because I left it till he was 18 mths old. Another thing is get him out and about and around people NOW, again I did not, mainly because knowing what he was like I was so concerned that if someone petted him and moved too fast he would latch on (which he would!) and although he is totally solid enviromentally despite my lack of socialization (gotta love genetics!)he is VERY unsocial, and I think my keeping him away from people is partly to blame.

Again, I feel I must point out that without seeing your pup I am not saying he is like this, nor should you do this, with him being your first Mal he may just be a "normal" one that seems crazy to you..

I think most people dont run across an intense dog like Sammy's.My Mal isnt that intense and he is way too much dog for most people.
I really feel IMO that you HAVE to have both respect and trust in the pup or dog.There is a fine line that you have to live on ,especially with a dog like that.
I was just commenting because I see alot of people that tend to correct too much and too hard.
Correct when you NEED to and ignore what you can,when you can.Learn to read the dog before you go correcting.JMO.

Thank you to all that took the time to reply. A couple of points for clarification.

I like Jeff's idea to not even intervene while he's tangled and worked up. Hopefully I don't get lazy with the long line again so this isn't an issue, but if it does... thanks. As far as the food dish thing, like I said, it's not a habit nor something I'll repeat, I was more or less testing the waters. Like you said, good, no reaction. I won't be repeating it. And very good point on the escalation of corrections. I don't want to have to put a round into him when he doesn't do his positions properly later... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I agree with Greg that people desire a high drive pup and then freak out, but I assure you, I'm far from freaking out. I just want to make sure I don't diminish drives with over correcting while at the same time keep consistent with who the pack leader is in his mind. Hence the queery on the board. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

And thank you Ed for the response. I will be ordering those two videos. I have a couple others from you but neither of those. Worth noting, I have decided to take my female out of FR for the time being. Long story kinda short... We had a seminar for our club a few weeks back and I was told (much to my suprise) that my female is a good candidate for FR. However, I would have to change her home life quite a bit. She currently is free to play with the family while I'm at work (night shifts and day shifts) When I bought her I never had the intention of putting her in Ring, so there was no foundation work done, nor had I been doing anything "right" up until she was approx. six months old. Her drives are reasonably good but she has way too much play time currently with the family diminishing her desire to play the "correct" games. Unfortunately I can't change anything in that area as I had to put my old guy down 2 weeks ago (17 yr old Malamute Husky that I've had since he was 9 weeks old <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> and my son is almost missing him as much as me... so taking away play time with his "other best friend" at this point isn't an option. So with the GSD being allocated a "pet" for the time being I think I'll be OK having both puppies in the family. I wouldn't try and tackle raising two competing dogs while trying to work full time and still be a dad. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Anyway, thanks for the feedback folks. Guess I've got some videos to order. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Grant

 Quote:

Correct when you NEED to and ignore what you can

Agreed!!!

>>>I guess I'm wondering if I've got a real problem on my hands

***No....just need more experience with the breed. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />