I was watching a AKC type club do some trainig with long lines for the sit stay command. The group appeared to be at a begining/intemediate pet level. I was confused when I heard the head trainer state if the dog broke the sit say no and "go in and correct" She actually said "dont use that line to correct'. Even when I do not agree with a method I try not to dismiss it before I try to understand but I do not see how this could be better than using the line to correct. What would be the purpose of the line? She also stated even if you say no and the dog resits/stays go in and correct. Wouldn't the dog then be corrected for doing the right thing and learn to show unhappy (for lack of a better term) behavior as their owner approaches in fear of a correction?
My original reason for observing this club was trying to find a intermediate class for an older Mal I have. I will not be going there but still wondering if there is something I am missing in this method.
thanks
Mike J Schoonbrood Webboard User Reg: 04-30-2005
Posts: 2784
Loc: Toronto, ON
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The correction comes too late if you have to walk up the dog, correct the dog, then walk back... however, if I act annoyed n walk towards my dog for breaking a stay, he immediately sits n sometimes downs in submission thinking he's in trouble, but that's a real-world sitaution, not a training scenario, in training you should be able to control this situation better - if the dog's on a long line, I would have the line hook around something like a pole behind the dog, so if the dog breaks his sit n starts walking towards me, I can jerk the line and keep him from coming closer to me at the same time because he's being pulled backwards away from me.
Usual disclaimer: This is my opinion I'm not a professional trainer yadda yadda yadda <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
I can see your concern/ I really have no idea what their thought process would be behind that. I agree with Mike. I teach a down stay by wrapping the long line around a fence post and then walking away. If my dog tries to follow, he cannot. Then when I call him, I drop the line and it easily pulls around the poll, allowing my dog to come. I teach the down in motion the same way. I give the down command and count to 3, then step on the line. It only takes one or two tries for the dog to realise that it has to respond quikly and down when told. Im sorry I couldnt explain what they were teaching, but I dont see the method behiond their particular madness. lol.
Train the down first. then when the down is fairly solid in different areas you can start the stay. Down is not stay and stay is not down. the second the dog sorta downs, people want to get as far away as possible. The dog only sorta knows down, and then they want to move around. Then they start correcting. The dog has no idea why this is happening. So you get that nice cowering look.
train just the down till it is fast and reliable. Then train in other areas/distractions. Then work on time, try to get a couple of minutes. Then move around the dog, keeping in mind the back half of that circle is hard for the dog. During this time you are giving treats randomly.
When this is good and solid and you have about 5 minutes, you can move away. A strong foundation keeps you from training this stupid exercise forever. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />
Thanks everyone. I also teach with tie outs and rewards. Increasing time before any distance. I was just wondering if there was anything to the method they were using. Thanks again for confirming that it does not make sense!
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training class
#91638 - 12/08/2005 10:52 AM 
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