Lynne,
i just read this article that you sent, a little late, but it was very hectic on the forum for awhile.
I have great trust in Ed's advice in dealing with dogs and would be willing to follow his protocol in establishing pack structure but whether my husband could or not remains to be seen. I have sent the article to his computer so he can read it later. He may ask the question that occurs to me. Ed seems to refer to dogs that he has acquired from outside more than a dog that already lives with you, so I am not sure if this isolation for a period of time, ( he doesn't specify how long) should be done with a dog that someone has owned for 2 or more years. That may seem brutal to my husband to do that kind of complete turn around but if you and others on the list who have encouraged my learning pack structure believe that it is an important part of reversing the aggression that Kobe has been showing I think we should do our best to follow it.

Let me know what you think, thanks.
Nancy

Nancy,

does your computer play DVDs? Most do, depending on how new it is!!

Oh, Mariellena ( I love your name)
That is a sweet idea, but I would be very surprised to find someone with this exact DVD being willing to give it away. And since I need it last week or earlier I'll go ahead and order it and while waiting for it to arrive will go and get a DVD player.
So smart of you to suggest it, but its kind of a needle in the haystack. Hey, maybe someone will give me a DVD player, LOL.
Nancy

I am fairly sure the reason that Ed talks about doing this with new dogs is that all his long term existing dogs respect him...therefore he doesn't need to do it to them.
Sooo yes it is meant for a dog that has been living with you.
It is meant for a dog that doesn't respect you.
Dogs live in the moment, and It isn't cruel to isolate them for a few weeks.
They get to go out and exercise.
What is cruel is to not fix the problem and make the dog suffer for it.
This crate method that Ed uses is brilliant!
I used to have to recommend that client's dogs would need to be rehomed or put down because, while the dog might have been able to be rehabbed by a pro, there was no way that your average dog owner could do it.
Ed's way shows them who is boss without having to physically confront them.It is amazing and has enabled me to help lots of dogs that would have been lost causes.
If you follow all the steps on the vid, and exercise the snot out of the dog..lots of walks at heel, or behind you...not out front, then unless the dog is insane, you will have success.
The trick is doing what he says..all of it, not just the parts you like.
You and your husband must decide if you are going to play about with this, and end up putting him down anyway in a few months, or trust Ed for the master trainer that he is and do exactly what he says.
His methods will enable you to work with this large dog successfully.
I am more than happy to advise you anytime, but I would tell you the same thing that I tell my real world clients......If you won't work off Ed's videos, then I won't work with you.
Willie

Actually, I meant to request the DVD player. Not the DVD. My parents (long gone) got the name from a song popular during WWII. I came along in 1952. An oldie but a goodie.

Marcia,
My husband thinks his laptop he bought last summer will play DVDs, we'll try to figure it out when he comes in from playing with Kobe in back yard.
thanks for the idea, I never would have thought of that.
Nancy

Nancy, unless your husband bought a very old laptop I am pretty sure it has the required hardware to play DVDs. I don't think they make them without DVD players anymore. It may need software updates.

Willie,
Is there more on the DVD than is on the Pack Structure article? I assume there is. LIke how long do you isolate the dog? Is there a criterion that indicates when he is ready to be sprung?
That would not be easy to determine with a dog who is good as gold except a couple of out of character episodes, etc. NOt to be fastious but do you ask him if he respects you now,if not back in the slammer. I guess a good test would be if he can keep his hugh mouth shut when door bell rings or when UPS truck goes by. As far as lunging on people we won't know until he doesn't do it any more. Maybe these are details that the DVD will cover.
Interested in why you say the average dog owner could not do this? Maybe they are so soft hearted, like my husband, they don't have the stomach to incarerate their beloved "Fluffy", but Boy HOwdy, this dog owner would no have problem, as it is obvious that something critical is going on, either my failure or my husband's, probably both, and as I have said before it has to be changed, or we cannot keep Kobe. And for those who take this to mean I am looking for an excuse to euthanize my dog, just ask Ed what he would do if he could not instill a whole new attitude and change in behavior in this dog.
I am very impressed with the confidence you have in Ed's method of establishing pack structure and I do appreciate your offer to help and am willing to abide by your conditions. And since I am the one who paid for this dog, I will just tell my husband to pretend Kobe is not here for awhile, ( my Gawd, he could ruin the operation) and that Kobe will return to him a must better pet and we won't have to send him away.
By the way, do you know what it means when a big dog cries when his master comes home? I mean cries like a freakin baby, then lays down to have his tummy rubbed. He does NOT do this when I come home, maybe he hates me. ha ha.
I better get busy and order that DVD.
Hope you know I am grateful for your input,
Nancy

No he bought a new Dell. I will look for the instruction book when I get off of this computer.
Hope it is not in the motor home as we bought it when we were in N.C. last summer. well, we have time to find it as I haven't ordered the DVD yet and that will take awhile to get here.
Nancy

Willie,
Is there more on the DVD than is on the Pack Structure article? I assume there is. LIke how long do you isolate the dog? Is there a criterion that indicates when he is ready to be sprung?
That would not be easy to determine with a dog who is good as gold except a couple of out of character episodes, etc. NOt to be fastidious but do you ask him if he respects you now,if not back in the slammer. I guess a good test would be if he can keep his huge mouth shut when door bell rings or when UPS truck goes by.

The video goes into detail. And yes, when he starts listening to you in all areas...Ed makes them earn privileges.

 Quote:

That would not be easy to determine with a dog who is good as gold except a couple of out of character episodes,

Nancy...please hear me......These are not a couple of out of character episodes..It is a developing and escalating pattern that has been going on since the first day he would not listen to your commands to stop the undesired behaviors.
ANd this thinking is the reason that most owners can't rehabilitate their dogs..they wont completely humble themselves and change their thinking. It can be really hard to stand there and agree with a trainer that says the dog is this way because you did something wrong..weather you meant to or not.
I almost destroyed a dog that we love because I screwed up..and I knew better.....its hard to own that..and that is why most fail. The second reason is that is is grueling and takes lots of time and effort.

I do appreciate your offer to help and am willing to abide by your conditions.
Good, lets do it.

And since I am the one who paid for this dog, I will just tell my husband to pretend Kobe is not here for awhile, ( my Gawd, he could ruin the operation) and that Kobe will return to him a must better pet and we won't have to send him away.

Love the commitment, but he needs to be on board...or it won't work. You live together as a pack, and he will have to eventually take part...or he will have the same problems you are having now.
The dog will know whats up and nothing will be different when your husband handles the dog.


By the way, do you know what it means when a big dog cries when his master comes home? I mean cries like a freakin baby, then lays down to have his tummy rubbed. He does NOT do this when I come home, maybe he hates me. ha ha.

It means that he is demanding attention in a dominant controlling way.
Pet me or I will throw a fit.

I better get busy and order that DVD.
Hope you know I am grateful for your input,
Nancy
Thank you.