Becky Shilling wrote 02/09/2006 10:39 PM Re: Heat & Heat Stroke [Re: Patrick Murray ] #97608 - 02/09/2006 10:39 PM
Becky Shilling Webboard User Reg: 12-01-2005 Posts: 1009 Loc: OKC, Oklahoma Offline	Think of the dog's stomach as a elongated bag suspended by two ligaments. When the stomach gets really full of water, the ligaments stretch. What causes torsion is the stomach flipping over. The weight of water, plus it's sloshing action could precipitate an incident. I don't know an instance that I can absolutely point to and say "this caused it", but then no one really knows what brings on GDV for certain. Having lost three dogs over the last 25 years to bloat, I try to do everything possible to prevent it. In all my cases, two Dobermans and one GSD/Great Dane mix, they were getting older (8+), when it happened.
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Patrick Murray wrote 02/09/2006 11:26 PM Re: Heat & Heat Stroke [Re: Becky Shilling ] #97609 - 02/09/2006 11:26 PM
Patrick Murray Webboard User Reg: 07-17-2001 Posts: 157 Loc: Orlando Offline	Becky, thanks for the explanation. That certainly sounds plausible. And I'm very sorry to hear of the loss of your three dogs to bloat. That's terrible! I'm going to presume that your dogs had not consumed a large amount of water prior to their tragedies. Patrick Murray
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Robert VanCamp wrote 02/09/2006 11:55 PM Re: Heat & Heat Stroke [Re: Mike J Schoonbrood ] #97610 - 02/09/2006 11:55 PM
Robert VanCamp Webboard User Reg: 11-28-2001 Posts: 3916 Loc: Offline	Hydrate your dog prior to working in heat. I've pretty much got my dogs to the point where they will eat and drink on command. I make them drink water before leaving to training. Keep water available to your dog while working. Keeping ice on hand is an easy easy way to cool down the dogs. Toss a few bags of ice and a dog into a Vari crate and you've got a cool dog.
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Becky Shilling wrote 02/09/2006 11:56 PM Re: Heat & Heat Stroke [Re: Patrick Murray ] #97611 - 02/09/2006 11:56 PM
Becky Shilling Webboard User Reg: 12-01-2005 Posts: 1009 Loc: OKC, Oklahoma Offline	Definitely not in two cases. Not sure about the third, but it wasn't overly hot so..... who knows. My first big Dobe (he was 10), had actually bloated once before, but I caught him early and he recovered. The second time I woke up to find him already past the point of recovery. He had only had a small meal for dinner. He had a strong family history of bloat so I was always very careful with him. Probably genetic predisposition had more to do with his incident than anything else.
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Mike Armstrong wrote 02/10/2006 12:40 AM Re: Heat & Heat Stroke [and bloat] [Re: Becky Shilling ] #97612 - 02/10/2006 12:40 AM
Mike Armstrong Webboard User Reg: 08-06-2005 Posts: 615 Loc: San Diego, CA Offline	Suppose you were an idiot. Suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself. -Mark Twain
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Becky Shilling wrote 02/10/2006 01:10 AM Re: Heat & Heat Stroke [and bloat] [Re: Mike Armstrong ] #97613 - 02/10/2006 01:10 AM
Becky Shilling Webboard User Reg: 12-01-2005 Posts: 1009 Loc: OKC, Oklahoma Offline	Sorry to hear that, Mike. I don't think stress played into either my 1st Dobe or my GSD/GrD mixes' problems. In my female Dobes' case, everything was atypical — she was a smallish dog (only 65 pounds), she hadn't eaten, drank or exercised prior to the incident and on radiographs there was a lot of abnormal appearing gas-filled loops of lower intestine as well as the torsed stomach. I didn't want her cut open for a post-mortem, so I'll never know for sure what happened in that case. I wish they would find some definitive answers as to causation. Sure would make us big dog lovers sleep easier at night.
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Mike J Schoonbrood wrote 02/10/2006 07:17 AM Re: Heat & Heat Stroke [Re: Robert VanCamp ] #97614 - 02/10/2006 07:17 AM
Mike J Schoonbrood Webboard User Reg: 04-30-2005 Posts: 2784 Loc: Toronto, ON Offline	Quote: I've pretty much got my dogs to the point where they will eat and drink on command. Of all the things I've taught my dog, drinking and peeing on command have been among the most useful <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> I think everyone should teach their dogs this. Pooping on command is a little tougher, he understands what I want him to do, but he doesn't comply, he has a ritual to perform before he'll poop, which usually involves finding 2 or more potential locations to poop in, then running back n forth between each potential poop spot, sniffing, then bolting to the other one... it's like the running before pooping helps him "get it out"...
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Brad . Martin wrote 02/10/2006 08:57 AM Re: Heat & Heat Stroke [Re: Mike J Schoonbrood ] #97615 - 02/10/2006 08:57 AM
Brad . Martin Webboard User Reg: 09-14-2005 Posts: 587 Loc: Ontario, Canada Offline	To comment on the subject of an indication of the dogs body temp; I've never heard of using the ears before, sounds interesting though, but I keep an eye on my dog's tongue as an indicator. When the tongue spreads out, almost flat, at the tip (like a spoon) and gets really really red it is time to take a break. The color gets very pronounced from all the blood that her body is trying to pass through the muscle. There are other tell tail signs but this seems to be a pretty good visual one for me. A question I'd like to add to this thread.. somewhere I read that pouring rubbing alcohol on the dogs tummy and inner thighs will draw out body heat. Has anyone ever heard of this method? Or better yet have experience using it?
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alice oliver wrote 02/10/2006 11:34 AM Re: Heat & Heat Stroke [Re: Brad . Martin ] #97616 - 02/10/2006 11:34 AM
alice oliver Webboard User Reg: 09-14-2005 Posts: 843 Loc: Offline	my giants are quite heat intolerant. in july, we sometimes have several days running with highs of 100-103. if they are outside, i hose their bellies down with cold water, especially the groin area. inside, i wrap them in soaking wet towels and then turn fans on them. the fans evaporate the water in the towels which has an air conditioning effect on them. the rest of the year it is too cool for air conditioning, so we don't have it. i usually only have to deal with this problem about three weeks out of the year. working Mastiff
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Beth Sparks wrote 02/10/2006 01:32 PM Re: Heat & Heat Stroke [Re: Becky Shilling ] #97617 - 02/10/2006 01:32 PM
Beth Sparks Webboard User Reg: 01-25-2006 Posts: 186 Loc: Offline	Our summers last from May-Aug. Last summer we had 75 days that were 100+ with 70-80% humidity. My girl ran all the time, but she drank alot of water!She would also dunk her whole head and legs in it. I guess this kept her cool because she never got overheated.
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