alice,
I'm sorry that you feel that I'm criticizing others, but when people are giving bad advice, I post that generic statement about the differing levels of advice given here. I've done it several times to protect new posters and I'll continue to do so when I see bad advice given.

New posters don't know who has experience here on the forum, and sometimes it needs to be pointed out that advice given with an authoritarian sound is still wrong, as the advice giver is basing that advice on a one time experience that was not typical or correct.

I'm trying to prevent people from getting injured, so feel free to complain to ADMIN or Ed if you don't like it, ok?

Could you please point out the questionable advice so Crystal and others in the future using the search function get something out of it? I didn't see anything totally damaging written, but my guess would be Alice in the billiard room with the lead pipe. This is turning into a game of Clue <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Alice I'm just kidding <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Barb,
I'm not trying to get into a pissing match here ( especially with you, as we've already spoken via PM and I hope I put your mind at ease ), my intial reply was sort of an FYI for a new poster about the nature of forums in general and this board in particular.

As a professional trainer, I ( and many other trainers, we speak via *pm *a lot* about these posts in private ) always get uncomfortable when beginner's are posting advice in the areas that require long experience with dog training ( like the Dominant dog area, or the Protection areas ).

People can post about Fluffy's minor problems all day long and if they get bad advice, no one is hurt. When you're dealing with the possibility of someone being injured.....well, that's a different ballgame.
I know many of the posters mean well, but if they could see the possible outcome of their advice ( which they can't due to their inexpereince ), I think that many of those posts wouldn't be made.

Yikes! I am sorry to have been the catalyst of all this!

If I knew there was a good trainer here in KY qualified or highly recommended to take my dog to, I would. I even asked Ed. Heck, I even asked him if I drove the 12 hours to see him if he would evaluate my dog (which, understandably, he is too busy for). I live in Lexington, KY. Does anyone know a trainer, (Will?) in this area that could do an evaluation?? I go to NC frequently too. I am an hour from Cincinnati and Louisville.

I don't want to get into a pissing match either, I hope I didn't come across that way. I didn't take your post as malicious but well intentioned. Some of us like to see errors pointed out, even our own. It's to the benefit of us and our dogs. Looking at the posts, I couldn't pick out the dangerous info. and since I'm always willing to try new methods, I thought it could be beneficial to myself and others to know what they were. It's great to know that advice in the thread isn't good, but it's even better to know which it is and why. Most of what I've learned has been from trial and error. I've tried and done things I probably shouldn't have and if I had found a message board that pointed out ideas that I may have gotten in my head that were bad, it could have saved me a lot of time. I understand it could get time consuming pointing out the why's and why nots and that this topic is a little complex for a message board. Sorry <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Crystal, you didn't cause anything don't worry, and I didn't think you came across as uninformed, just someone experiencing something you hadn't dealt with before <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> You'll probably feel better once you get the DVD.

Thank you Barbara. It has shipped so I hope I receive it soon.

will, if bad advice is given that could have harmful consequences, please do us all a favor and point it out and explain why. the door is wide open for an experienced trainer to please step in and educate us. why not take on that opportunity yourself?

not one of us can tell from your posts what the problem is with the advice given. we already know that not all advice posted is good advice. even among pros, there is often disagreement, and the lay person has to make choices as to which philosophy of training or methods they are going to use for their dog.

i think it is safe to say we are all here to learn. but that can only happen if those who are more knowledgeable step up and educate us.

thanks.

I coach at a highschool and was at a wrestling tournament over the weekend. A guy who ran clinics i've been to before was there, and i asked him a question and got some free advice, and was grateful for it -- just as I am for the advice will, ed and other professionals give on the board. I wouldn't expect lawyers, stockbrokers or other professionals to give out advice all the time, especially in a situation like this where the information is second hand and bad advice could result in injury. Crystal should find a good trainer and maybe a knowledgeable person could point her in the right direction.

I'm writing Crystal via PM, but my hand got sliced bad today and it's in a bulky dressing to prevent movement - so I'll be typing less for the next few days.
I'll still do my best to help her.

Grrr...I hate injuries! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

crystal, sam and will--

there HAS to be someone in her area to help her--she's too close to the ASR world center for there not to be. oooopppss--sorry, i'm not posting anything constructive; just hoping someone out there can point her in the right direction. (..and i know you're out there...)

i'm "gone johnson"...