Thanks Brad. I will get the book. I think I'm sending the wrong message...for all who are trying to help...I am not looking for a true PPD. I'm looking to get a handle on what my dog is capable of and from there get him to a point where I can command an alert as in bark aggressively/growl, another command that he stops this when told and, maybe, maybe, maybe down the road with all the stars in alignment consider taking him to the point where he would bite.

It's getting him to the first stage that is probably very easy but with me wanting to keep the door open for future PP (and I use that term very loosely) training as in biting.

My dog's a showline GSD and from what this board tells me, a showline doesn't have what it takes for a bite.

Anyway sorry if I wasn't more clear in my first post. I'm foolishly using phrases that are better left to those of you who have a clue what you're talking about in PPD arena <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> !

In short, I just want a really scarey sounding dog that I can command at will to sound off should I need it! So if this post changes your views, please let me know.

I usually don't even read threads on PPD's.
I read this one and it kind of upsets me really.
There is a mass confusion about what a PPD is it seems and even whether or no the poster wants one.
There is also a mess in regards to the focus of traiining a PPD and it is being confused with other types of dog training.
PPD can be a hobby or sport...basically someone wanting to do training with their dog and focusing on the ecclectic dog sports of PSA, ASR, etc. It can be a recreation for the dog and the handler w/ no specific goals.
Or, it can be serious stuff.
If it is simply something to do with your dog go fiddle around with the videos and drive grip and focus work. Find a group of people into sport of one soprt or another and train wit them.
If you are in need of a PPD that will function find some one who works and trains with service dogs and has a broad knowledge base of some of the sports. Find one that doesn't need your $$ and get the dog evaluated for potential and follow that persons guidelines and plan of at some point a concerted period of time learning to handle the dog and having the dog brought up to speed after the foundations have been established then plan on monthly training at the very least for the dog.
Some of the advice that has been handed out is great for sport work and bad for PPD work.
If you just want a well trained confident dog find a sport club to go train at. That's probably all you want anyway and all you need.

I emailed you about a simple type of "alarm dog" training for pet owners -- That may be all you actually need, Judy...

Kevin, what sort of foundation is okay before you take your dog to a trainer for true PPD work? (I assume the dog will need to be a certain age before this can be done).

Depends. That's why an expert is needed. It also revolves around the genetics of the dog and what your personal situation is like and how you live with the dog.
For me, a personal protection dog is a waste of time. I train sport and law ernforcement and for the people who ask me about PPD's I tell them come to the club, title your dog and I'll tweak it a bit if it's character can safely handle it.
This accomplishes the handler learning about their dog and getting the necessary time in and assures the dog is also doing things like being social and doing obedience. Lets me see if the handler is an idiot and I will want nothing to do with them or their dog, determine commitment to the training aspect, and see if the handler has the common sense to go with it.
What most people don't understand is a confident well mannered dog that can do things with you is first and foremost.
Not a nasty bad a$$.

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Kevin, what sort of foundation is okay before you take your dog to a trainer for true PPD work? (I assume the dog will need to be a certain age before this can be done).

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What most people don't understand is a confident well mannered dog that can do things with you is first and foremost.
Not a nasty bad a$$.

Kevin, would you say that a social dog is capable of protecting their handler in a real life situation? Because a number of people on this board have repeatedly told me that if you want a REAL PPD you need a fear biting demon who wants to eat everyone... well, they didn't say fear biting, but more often than not the dogs I've seen who wanna kill everyone are doing so out of fear rather than confidence and dominance. I've seen lots of social dogs who I'm convinced would rip me to shreds if the handler told the dog to bite me, but a few people would have me believe that these dogs wouldn't REALLY bite or stay in the fight.

I always say... if you REALLY need a protection dog, stop pissing people off or move house <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> A barking dog is more than enough for the average moron giving you crap on the street... does great for keeping bums from begging for money at interstate off ramps too LOL. hmmm I wonder what they'd say if you offered em $100 to test if your dog would really bite <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

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If you are in need of a PPD that will function find some one who works and trains with service dogs and has a broad knowledge base of some of the sports. Find one that doesn't need your $$ and get the dog evaluated for potential and follow that persons guidelines and plan of at some point a concerted period of time learning to handle the dog and having the dog brought up to speed after the foundations have been established then plan on monthly training at the very least for the dog.
Some of the advice that has been handed out is great for sport work and bad for PPD work.
If you just want a well trained confident dog find a sport club to go train at. That's probably all you want anyway and all you need.

Thanks Kevin and everyone. Yes, for now, a well trained, confident, highly obedient dog is what I'm looking for. To get there I am missing a few pieces of the puzzle. I've had the dog evaluated by 3 different people. Don't know if money was there motivation but in various ways, all 3 helpers said he could the job.

1) What is a concerted period of time in learning to handle the dog? 1, 2, 6 months, 1 year?

2) What do you mean, "Having the dog brought up to speed after the foundations have been established"? What is your term "brought up to speed" referring to? A bite? Perfect obedience? Confidence?

3) Is his young age (13 months) too soon to start? I get mixed answers on this.

3) How often would I use a helper if I'm not interested in a true PPD? 1/week, 3/week?

Thanks for all your help! As you can tell, Gunnar and I really need it <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> !

Judy

Mike:
"I always say... if you REALLY need a protection dog, stop pissing people off or move house"




Mike, to let you know, the number one reason that people contact me for a ppd is that they're being stalked by a former lover, etc. Do you really think that I should offer them the advice that you just put into print there?
And there are *several* people that I know personally that have made multiple moves to get away from the danger but the stalker still found them.
Think I should just tell them to "stop pissing people off"?

Sorry, I thought better of you before I read that statement.

Mike, that's a really easy thing for a *guy* to say. Or, really, anyone who's not less than half the size of the person after them...How many moves do you suggest before someone meets your requirements for needing a PPD? Just one? Or maybe 2-3? Then if they're still being stalked, and haven't been killed yet, is it ok to go get a dog? Or is there perhaps a 4 move minimum? Please let me know the rules.