do you have any videos of the dog working?

I'll get some uploaded somewhere as soon as I can, that can defintely lift a discussion above semantics, which tends to happen with these "theoretical" threads... Plus I'd definitely benefit from the feedback. Thanks.

Simon

sure, at that point you can reference actual actions within the video where certain "key" behaviors are exhibited.

Sounds like the thread is tilting toward the mythical fight drive <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Video is great for some things, but cant substitute for reading the dogs eyes, body posture , tail and such up close from the decoys perspective. Also we ( people seeing the video ) dont know what went on before the video , how the dog feels , ect.

Kinda like a physcian seeing a patient for the first time at a walk in clinic and trying to cure a host chronic illnesses the patient has suffered from for 20 yrs

Fight drive <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

I wasn't going to be the one to bring it up, at least not in reference to my own dog, lol.

Here's the thing, he's definitely not working in prey; and prey has only been a contributing factor quite recently.

To me he's working in defense, but usually now when people talk about defense their talking about a really uncomfortable space for the dog right on the edge of avoidance. This isn't the case with my bouvier, he doesn't mind the protection work. He may not enjoy it quite the same way a lot of dogs do (one of the reasons I'm still trying to elicit a greater prey response), but he still gets a kick out of scrapping with a helper.

The reason I stay away from using the term fight drive with my dog is that it's usually used in reference to really stong, confident, high-drive dogs. My dog has weaknesses, and I'm the first one to point them out: crappy grips, low hunt drive, a low defensive threshold (to the point that strict obedience is the only reason he's even mildly social)...

But through all that there seems to be a desire for "combat", and it's this desire that I've successfully employed to teach him that he can overcome the decoy. It seems to be going the way I want, but it's still early in the game. I just wanted to know if anyone had experience training like this and how it turned out.

Thanks

Simon

Nope, My GSD is in the same place as your Bouv,( actually one notch behind yours in training ) and since he is a paperless rescue dog I dont know his age. I can only guesstimate. Cudos for sticking with your dog.

Really I think your first post kinda touches on/ about all aspects/ nuances/ breed preference for protection work.

Could be a big discussion even without the mythical fight drive tossed in <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

 Quote:

Really I think your first post kinda touches on/ about all aspects/ nuances/ breed preference for protection work.

Could be a big discussion even without the mythical fight drive tossed in <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Ya, I definitely appreciate the responses thus far, but I kinda anticipated a bigger turnout <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />. I only brought this topic up cause I thought it was one of the few that hadn't been beaten to death. There's more than a few of the regular PPD contributors that have stayed out of this. If that's cause I'm somewhere way out in left field then let me have it, you don't come to this board to be coddled <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" />.

Simon:
Not alot of serious trainers for protection work in the USA. Period; if there were; it would be a heckuva lot easier to find a good pup, and alot more reasonably priced. <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> Not to mention " we " would all be on the same page, or at least a similar page. Americas large geographic size and affulence work aganist us here. Too many folks willing to plop down 3G$'s for far to medicore dogs. Not to mention most of american dogs of any breed are just pets, then toss in the show folks and well <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />