You couldn't give me the pick of the litter!!

while I might buy a pup out of an untitled parent, I don't think I'll buy (another) one that doesn't come from OFA'd / "a" stamped parents. I actually prefer to see OFA, OFEL, and some sort of screening for genetic diseases that the breed is predisposed to getting (ie thyroid, vWD, etc). And I don't place as much stock on the actual level of the rating either, some won't take from "fair" dogs, but the two bitches that we have, both parents were fair (at or over 4yrs), but have proven to produce better than they have (Kora is excellent, Femke is expected to go excellent). I don't have the "eye" for the Xrays (yet), so I have to rely on the "expert's" opinions.

VanCamp please explain why three top orthopedic specialists opinion that are not OFA not good enough to buy a puppy from? Just curious... I am asking this question because there was a debate on another list about credibility of OFA, A stamp, and other more qualified specialists. The discussion came about when discussing x-rays that were sent to OFA and A stamp (same exact x-rays) came back with different evaluations. Who is to say OFA is correct, or A stamp.

I'd get a copy of the films and send them to the UK to be scored. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> The KC hip evaluation process is much better than the OFA as far as information that the owner receives. Yes, films from my next animal will probably go there.

I guess my question would be, why didn't the hypothetical breeder send the Xrays to OFA (if she lived in the States) or OVC (Canada)? If she took the time to have the Xrays evaluated by three orthopods, why was the cost/risk of sending the Xrays to OFA/OVC avoided? Sounds fishy to me. Personally, I would be suspicious and would not want a puppy out of that breeding.

Well, I'll tell you why.

The private opinions might be fine for myself, for a personal dog that I had no intention of breeding, but not for a dog that I may re-sell or breed. It comes down to this, OFA or A are the standards that everyone expects to see in a pedigree. I may believe the other opinions, but it starts to sound shady when I try to explain that to somebody else. "Well that dog wasn't OFA'd he had three letters from so-and-so that said his hips were good." That isn't what I wanna hear when I am looking at buying a dog. There may be exceptions with friends or people that you know well, but it just doesn't sound that great to somebody you don't know.

Does that make sense? Sure OFA and A can make mistakes, sure it isn't a perfect evaluation, but it is what we have to help ensure that people are not breeding bad dogs. Anyone that is looking for a GSD, and has done their research, knows to make sure the dog has been OFA'd.

Whatta ya gonna do?

 Quote:

Originally posted by RottnK9:
I guess my question would be, why didn't the hypothetical breeder send the Xrays to OFA (if she lived in the States) or OVC (Canada)? If she took the time to have the Xrays evaluated by three orthopods, why was the cost/risk of sending the Xrays to OFA/OVC avoided? Sounds fishy to me. Personally, I would be suspicious and would not want a puppy out of that breeding.

It's hypothetical question and breeder so I can't ask her <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

The discussion I was having on the other list came down to the fact that these registries are having a lot of errors in their readings and many dogs that should not pass are passing and some are getting shafted that should pass with flying colors. There were many examples of dogs being x-rayed not passing and then re sending those same x-rays a few months later and getting an OFA Good. How can this be? How can there be such a huge margin of error? How can I trust a registry that evaluates the same x-ray just months a part failing one time and passing with a GOOD the next. I look at it like this. If I had a dog's hips done and sent them to the ten top orthopedic surgeons in the country and had them evaluated them as OFA would (excellent good fair etc) and they all said good and then I sent them to OFA and they said mildy dysplastic what makes those three outweigh the 10 "goods" I received from non OFA evaluators. So then we have a dog that probably has good hips but now doesn't have the oppurtunity to be bred. Same goes for the opposite. Many dogs passing and being bred that shouldn't. I understand we need a registry and an outline to go by, I'm just questioning the errors that seem to be coming to the surface a lot lately and that concerns me.

I understand concerns about the accuracy of OFA evaluations, but it is a business decision. You can't do business without it.

Like if you are a china delivery person. You have to have a license to drive legally, right? If you don't have the license are people gonna want you to deliver their china sets?

I don't think so. You could be the best friggin' driver on the face of the planet, how the -F- do I know?

If you wanted to talk about the validity of OFA evaluations why not say, "what do you guys think of OFA?".

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

I wish there was a perfect test and evaluation out there. Why don't you make one, then I'll send you my money instead of some jerk over at OFA that I don't know.

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

VanCamp, did I forget to mention I am the perfect evaluator <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> You can just go ahead and make that check out to me. Better yet, just send cash <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

I would only buy a pup from OFA or A stamped parents but would also want to know that at least three to four generations back on both sides of ped were clear also. You know these hip rating system's were put in place for a reason,to help breeders reduce the chances of dysplasia in what they breed. Sure there will be some mistakes made when you add in the human factor, and if a few dogs fail that should of passed, or vice versa, well thats the price we pay. Personly i would be more concerned about dogs passing that should have failed. Just my opinion!