Quote: david c.frost

I don't believe it's a matter of "egos" with law enforcement. Rather a "once burned, twice shy" attitude. Law enforcement trains to specific standards. Not all SAR teams do. Until law enforcement gains confidence in a particular SAR unit, they do tend be a bit apprehensive.

DFrost

David,

EXCELLENT statement. And I agree with you 110%. Our small team has worked hard, and has made some great relationships with LE.
We let our dogs speak for themselves rather than talking about it a whole lot.
In fact, we just got done with a demo today up near the Black Hills and there were a couple of LE "skeptics". After the dogs were out, walking around with us meeting the kids, we then did a HRD demo, they asked for business cards from each of us and said they would definitely be calling on us for assistance if they needed it. In fact, when I got home from my four hour drive, I had emails of "thanks" from them. YES!!!!

You cannot talk LE into anything, but when they see it and see that we work hard and train to high national standards, it all works out. It was a GREAT day.

We prove a little at a time that there are serious SAR handlers and units out there, and we are that much closer to repairing the relationships that the "yahoos" have damaged.

Carol: Totally agree and great job. sorry if I offended anyone in Law Enforcement
while trying to "start" our SAR we were met with a whole lot of opposition with towns that had K9 patrol units. All we do is search and recovery, we do not use our Dogs for protection, fugitive hunts, drugs, bombs and our dogs are not subject to all the hours the Officer and K9 put in. Basically our dogs are "search + rescue- 24 /7 vs.- a K9 Dog and Officer that has so many other aspects to their training and job. Once we "proved" ourselves we enjoy a great relationship however getting to where we are now was extremely hard and we lost so many great handlers and dogs due to the flustration of getting accepted plus not recieving any compensation for our efforts. The gentleman from UK was asking about starting a SAR unit and I advised Him of most of "our" problems. Tom

No offense taken at all. I will agree that there are some ego's out there, in all disciplines of the dog world.
I am a reserve officer along with a FF, EMT and K9 handler, so that helps a little. (keeps me plenty busy too.... )

I do agree that the road is rough when trying to work with LE though. But I understand where they come from when skeptical about things.

 Quote: carol boche

I do agree that the road is rough when trying to work with LE though. But I understand where they come from when skeptical about things.

Absolutely true!
BUT... I have seen a case fall apart due to contamination of evidence from a person that no longer does S&R. That department never wanted to use the service again - even though it was one person. It ruined a lot of hard work and trashed the reputation of the service simply because of one "bad egg". When everything is on the line, a reasonable amount of skepticism is to be expected.

I also had a good working relationship with LE but it took some time and great effort on my part for them to realize I was serious. I was the sole dog handler on a well respected SAR unit in Metchosin, British Columbia. I had the privelege of training with the Western Communities RCMP for which Curtis Horton (featured in Leerburg tracking videos) was Dog Master.
My Dobie bitch Raven http://www.leidenschaftkennels.ca/Raven.htm was the only civilian dog Curtis had certified in his 25+ years on the job. He simply had not had any teams meet the qualifications before.
Unfortunately when we moved east to New Brunswick we were told by the RCMP here that we could train, and re-certify, but we were unlikely to be used because of funding and politics. A sad and frustrating end to what took so many hours of training to accomplish.
If you have a love for the work do it, only you can decide if your efforts will be worth the politics.

Rob, As a police officer here in the states I can honestly say that it sounds like you are experiencing some of the same obstacles that we face here in the states. Time and again I've seen officers (myself included) try to propose new programs or new units and the attitude you are faced with is "We've done fine without it up until now, therefore we don't need it." I think that's the mindset that Tom was talking about when he said "ego's." It's easy to see, from the outside, how that can be confused for ego; "We'll do just fine without it thanks." (Tom, I wouldn't worry about offending. I understood your point.)
Rob, my advice to you is to handle this the same way cops around the world handle everything: we press on. If they turn you down now, that does not mean they will turn you down forever. Sometimes you can get a sense from your administration when the time is right for such a proposal and their timing may not be yours. I learned a great saying from a colleague of mine who is a former USA Ranger: FIDO (F$%# It Drive On.) We get cynical in this job and lose our enthusiasm sometimes, but you just have to FIDO.
By the way, I am not just blowing steam here either. 15 years on the job and about to submit a proposal for the creation of a K-9 unit. The third such proposal I've written in my career. Throw enough stuff against the wall, eventually something will stick!

Stay Safe,

Joe Collins

Well, a brief update for you - I had a reply from the head of Ops Support. He's said that we can actually call out on or two volunteer units to assist, but it has to be done through the Specialist Search Advisors first.

It's hard enough finding on of them when you need one in a hurry, so the chances of getting the S&R dogs is very minimal!

He did like the idea, but as always it comes down to money and the 'business case' (not Empires, I'm sure ) Maybe I'll just keep an eye out on operational efficiency and suggest it again at some point in the future.

Thanks to all those replied - great info, I really appreciate the help - and a big thanks from LE to all the volunteers too.

 Quote: Joseph Collins

15 years on the job and about to submit a proposal for the creation of a K-9 unit. The third such proposal I've written in my career. Throw enough stuff against the wall, eventually something will stick!

I learned a great saying from a colleague of mine who is a former USA Ranger: FIDO (F$%# It Drive On.) We get cynical in this job and lose our enthusiasm sometimes, but you just have to FIDO.

Me too - 15 years and I've yet so see a S&R unit called out for 'run of the mill' missing persons searches.

However, I LOVE that phrase! Not heard that one before. I'll definately remember that, and try to keep some of the cynicism at bay.

In the words of a famous Sergeant - Lets be careful out there.

Rob

Edited by Rob Bruce (06/02/2008 05:53 PM)
Edit reason: Tired and forgot to say thanks