Quote: carol boche

I agree with you Mike, however, if this kid is tormenting the dogs or trespassing and gets bit, then Carolyn needs to know where she stands as a responsible pet owner.

Carolyn....make sure to document EVERYTHING.

When I typed trespassing here, I was thinking of him trespassing in your yard rather than the neighbors yard.

That is what I meant when I talked about finding out the "laws".

I think I was clear as mud in the above post.....sorry...

To me, if I put up a solid fence within my property line and respect the regulations on how far from the property line my fence should be, that should be enough.

It's not nice if a kid were to get bitten, but it's also not my responsibility to teach the kid not to stick body parts through other peoples fences.

I wonder how this kid responded after you yelled at him? Some are so shocked and scared by a confrontation like this it may have gotten the point across. I wonder, too, how this kid's mother is with teaching him stuff. Hopefully she won't just blow it off.

And IMHO the only (sad) inappropriate thing you said to the boy was about the dogs not liking him... I can't help it! I'm a softy for "weird" kids!

 Quote: stephanie biros

And IMHO the only (sad) inappropriate thing you said to the boy was about the dogs not liking him... I can't help it! I'm a softy for "weird" kids!

There are people that my dogs do not care for and sometimes you have to say it that way, or, they just keep on trying to "get the dog to like them". I have dealt with people trying to pet or stick there hands in crates EVEN though my dogs are growling and the person is saying "OH, ALL dogs like me..." UGH

It is what it is and sometimes you have to point that out.

I am a softy for "weird" kids too, worked with them for years at a theraputic horseback riding program, but that does not stop me from avoiding a potential dog bite.

 Quote: carolyn pike

I felt sorry for the kid albeit a bit uncomfortable in his presence.

I have never allowed this kid in the house, and will never: to be honest he now makes me uncomfortable at best. His favorite topics of conversation range from "how many home-made guns I've made" to "my mom took away xyz" to "guess what, I've been shooting my cats with my nerf gun".

Dog's are good at reading people. It's likely that the dogs are picking up on your unease around this kid. It also sounds like he has a penchant for tormenting animals and other inappropriate hobbies. As Carol Boche says it's possible the dogs are either sensing this or as you suspect, he has teased the dogs in the past when you weren't there.

One thing I've learned about dogs is to respect their opinions about people. If my dog doesn't like someone I'm especially cautious about that person myself.

Kids with ADHD have a tendency to be impulsive and not consider the consequences of their actions. I know because I have ADD myself. That of course is no excuse however for tormenting animals. My parents taught me how to behave and relate to animals from a very early age. You also say the family has a couple dogs they let run lose all over the neighborhood. I've made the observation that often the way people raise their dogs is a reflection on how they raise their children.

I'd start by talking to the mother. If that works fine but if it doesn't then I wouldn't hesitate to talk to the police if you think it warrants that. If the mother has that many health problems and can't look after her kid then she really shouldn't be home schooling in the first place.

A kid with those kinds of problems needs more not less structure and help in school. I know it's difficult to get a school system to step up to the plate and provide the services they should for a child with the disabilities this kid has but that's no excuse for pulling him out of school and then just letting him roam the streets. I'm not against home schooling. I've seen where home schooling is a great benefit but this doesn't sound like one of those cases.


Oh and I second/third the opinion. You handled the situation perfectly.

Carolyn,

I see this as an opportunity for neighborly cooperation, not confrontation.

The kid was a guest in the neighbor's yard, right? And you have good relations with that neighbor? Then start with them, tell them about your dogs going nuts when the kid is near the fence and ask them if they'll agree to asking him to keep his distance from the fence. They may want to talk to their own kids about this too, so they don't get the kid into an unfortunate position because no one was thinking.

Once you have their cooperation, then ask to talk to the kid and his mother together. Explain how you are working on your dogs manners, and for reasons unknown they react poorly towards him, and could you guys help me out by staying away from the neighbor's fence when you are playing with the neighbors kids.

If that works, great. If not, then maybe it is time to get confrontational.

Even the best of children (which this kid is not) will forget sometimes when they are playing and go where they shouldn't be. They don't do it on purpose, they do it because they aren't thinking. So even if everyone is cooperative and agrees to your wishes, still expect an incident to arise from time to time.

 Quote: rich pallechio

tell them about your dogs going nuts when the kid is near the fence and ask them if they'll agree to asking him to keep his distance from the fence.

 Quote: rich pallechio

Explain how you are working on your dogs manners, and for reasons unknown they react poorly towards him, and could you guys help me out by staying away from the neighbor's fence when you are playing with the neighbors kids.

I would be cautious here. In the event the kid has teased, or has been up to something, if he continues and is bit, well that would look (to an investigator or judge) as though you have dangerous dogs, you KNOW you have dangerous dogs, you warned the neighbors and mother you have dangerous dogs, and they bit they kid they have been "tormenting"
In a case like that, depending on the judge, there seems to be little concern for the fact the animal was tortured for months on end and teased, and finally got the kid.
I would definitely document, as is mentioned. I would not say you are working on the dogs' behavior to anyone - not even the neighbors you like. I would simply state a fact - "please don't allow the children (as in ALL of them) to tease the dogs through the fence" I wouldn't ask them to stay away from the fence, as that is their property and they have a right to be there...
As far as the mother goes, I would start by finding out the law rather than talking to the mother first.
You don't have to mention names, just simply go into the police office and find out what happens in the event that your dogs are being teased/tormented by some neighbor kids, and what can you do. They won't file unless you ask them to, and if you don't provide names they won't be talking about it to the neighbors. At that point, if there is NOTHING you can do about it (if the dog bites the kid after it has been told not to go near it/ stay out of the yard, etc), I would report it. I don't care that the kid has been in hot water previously, I simply don't want my dogs to be put down because they bit a kid who couldn't follow simple boundaries. If the kid has not done anything that is against the law, you reporting it is not going to do anything but build a history, and possibly get the kid talked to by authorities.
I also feel that the way the dogs are treated reflects the home environment, and I would rather address it officially and have it be record that you have tried to do the right thing so there is a recourse in the horrible case that something happens.
Sadly, there are some places where a "beware of dog" sign means you are aware of a dangerous animal living in your house, and you did nothing, therefore if it attacks someone, you are liable and can be brought up on criminal charges. In other places, it is the exact opposite. You have a posted warning and the person was trespassing, therefore they took a risk and lost, their fault for trespassing. It depends on where you live, and what has happened recently as well. If a child was mauled to death in the past year nearby, I guarantee you your dogs will possibly be shot on arrival of the police if it bites, and will most likely be mandated to be put to sleep after quarrantine. (Last year two toddlers in this town on two separate, unrelated incidents in separate places were killed by dog attack due to abuse/neglect of dog and not watching/supervising the toddler. One child was 3 with NO parents or adults home at all. About a month after the second one, a dog was shot by police because it bit it's owner. She called an ambulance, and the police arrived and killed the dog before entering the house. The dog was supposedly not being aggressive, the officer was simply not taking a chance of being bit and shot instead. It was allowed and nothing done because of the history of the previous, yet also unrelated incidents - one of which was a few streets away)
I would personally start with LE to find out what options you have then go from there.

Thanks all--

The kid's response was "I'm sorry, did you have a bad day?" then shrugged and started to crawl out. I guess I felt initially like what I said was inappropriate because he was an 'invited' guest in the neighbors back yard- I should have just asked him if he would please find a different place to hide AWAY from the dogs, lol. I think it probably does come down to common sense and ability to make a good decision. The neighbors and I are on pretty good terms I would like to think. Especially as of late: their cat (which I had been gently suggesting they neuter) went into its first heat and promptly had kittens. I have been really careful about letting the dogs out only after doing a kitten check in my backyard!!

**sigh**

Regarding my area-- a friend of mine is a retired canine handler from the local police department. He told me that if I wanted to put up a sign, then to make sure it didn't give any warnings or indications that the dogs were dangerous because of some of the reasons you mentioned, Cameron. Consequently I have a sign that simply says "dogs on premises".

I will do some research for local laws, and probably talk to the mother as well. I've been trying to think of a polite way to ask her to watch their dogs more closely anyway... This thing with many of the neighbors letting their dogs run loose drives me bonkers.

Again- thanks all.

 Quote: carolyn pike

.... and probably talk to the mother as well. I've been trying to think of a polite way to ask her to watch their dogs more closely anyway... This thing with many of the neighbors letting their dogs run loose drives me bonkers.

That could be a good "let's all make this a great neighborhood for dogs and kids with these steps" starter, too. Kinda like one for all, etc.

I wanted to add that I'd carefully avoid any "the dogs don't like you" comments (I do realize that it was in the heat of the moment) for another reason: I want no reasons at all for any kid to resent my dogs or to be wanting to "get back at" or "show them" dogs who they perceive as their enemy or even an agent of getting them into trouble.

I want my dogs to be objects of sympathy or friendliness or anything positive by kids in the area, and never a perceived enemy.

I know I started this thread a while ago-- but couldn't help updating, it's sad. The young man's mother was taken to the hospital a week ago. I saw him on a walk with one of my dogs and he ran up and traipsed along with me. Told me his mom was being loaded into the ambulance right that second, and asked if he could live at my house for a week . I had to tell him no, but was concerned and asked who he was staying with, and he replied "the a**hole". He finally said he was staying with his cousin (who I verified was an adult).

We arrived back at my driveway and I could see them wheeling her into the back... I told him he needed to go hold her hand and tell her he loved her; he says "she won't hear me anyway, she's not awake", I told him to do it anyway. He ran up and I saw an adult come out and give him a hug and walk over to the ambulance with him.

Poor kid As frustrated as I was with him I hope his mom recovers. He said she'd been in bed for almost two weeks and couldn't get up.