Quote: shannon reed

... used to be just rice but now they are using rice, barley, millet, peas. When pet food manufactures do this they can add more grains as each individual grain does not weigh more than the meat preceding it. .... My thought is the total grain content is most likely higher than the total meat content.

Shannon

Bingo.

Two great ways to increase the cheap grains (proportionately to the meat) are by using lots of kinds of grains so that each one, listed separately, falls below the meat, but all of them added together and called "grains" could far exceed the meat, and/or by using grain "fractions" (rice bran, brewer's rice, etc.) for the same reason -- and to use throw-away by-products.

I've been noticing some changes with canidae for a few months now. There are some rather disturbing changes happening with the pet food companies with the rising ingredient costs. Nutro (which I don't feed) was recently purchased by Mars (the candy bar company.) This production delay with them is actually them reformatting the cost per pound for their products.

A few months ago I found field corn in my canidae canned food which did not make me amused as it's not an ingredient I will feed my dogs. I couldn't even get the company to respond with anything other than oh.... sorry. Just return it for another.

So keep an eye out. I'm sure there will be some ground shaking going on.

 Quote: Shannon Reed

Here is the link to the Canidae formula change.
http://www.canidae.com/new-formulas.html

Basically the formula change is that they are diversifying their grains--used to be just rice but now they are using rice, barley, millet, peas. When pet food manufactures do this they can add more grains as each individual grain does not weigh more than the meat preceding it.

Not being a someone who believes dogs need grains as part of a healthy diet, the ingredient list seems very heavy on the grains to me. My thought is the total grain content is most likely higher than the total meat content.

Shannon

I'm not defending Canidae, but if you scroll down to the bottom of the link I provided, they show the proportion of grains being lower vs meat, than in the old formula. (same link as the one Shannon has)

You are correct, Lynne. I should have followed the link.

I still don't like grain fractions; also, barley is more allergenic than rice (as far as I know, rice is the least allergenic grain, and then quinoa; this is gluten-related).

But my first reaction to increased types of grains was wrong (to increase total grain while still looking good on the ingredients list).

For once.

 Quote: Connie Sutherland

I still don't like grain fractions; also, barley is more allergenic than rice (as far as I know, rice is the least allergenic grain, and then quinoa; this is gluten-related).

That's good to know; I only knew about the big bad two...corn and wheat...

(ps I don't feed Canidae any more; I am now feeding(alternating)EVO, Innova and Wellness Core, alternated w/ raw. )

And I think it remains to be seen with Canidae; perhaps they were feeling some pressure from the better kibbles to improve their blend.
I wish that the kibbles would list percentages for each ingredient; of course, we don't even do that with people food, so why why would dog food companies do it...

From the dogfoodproject website...

QUOTE from http://www.dogfoodproject.com/

Upcoming changes to Canidae formulations
Admin | June 30, 2008 3:56 pm
I wanted to give a heads up to dog owners feeding Canidae products about a few details that the makers of this product aren't telling you in their sales pitch for their changed formulas:

Under the new formulation, Canidae dry foods will no longer be gluten free, due to the addition of barley. If you know that your dog is gluten intolerant, start shopping around for a different food.

Even if your dog doesn't have problems with gluten (not all do, and many foods do contain high-gluten grains like barley), the change in formulation to include rice bran and peas may contribute to gas and digestive upset. Dogs who aren't particularly sensitive may not have any problems at all, others will get over it within a few days of transitioning, but again, for individuals with a delicate digestive system, expect that they may no longer tolerate the product.

Millet is generally well tolerated, but again, it doesn't work for every dog.

"Diversifying" ingredients may sound catchy, and Canidae certainly has made an effort to put a positive spin on it in their statement, but please remember that not all dogs do well on foods that include a wide variety of items.

Also note that "Herring Meal" will be replaced by generic "Ocean Fish Meal", meaning the company reserves the possibility to use different fish from batch to batch without having to change the ingredient list. This has not been addressed in their statement at all.

Whether these changes are indeed an improvement, as Canidae claims, is for you to decide - after observing how it affects your dog.

Canidae All Lifestages
Old Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/all_life_stages/dry.html
New Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/all_life_stages/dry2.html

Canidae Platinum
Old Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/platinum/dry.html
New Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/platinum/dry2.html

Canidae Chicken & Rice
(Note that after the change it's no longer going to be a true "Chicken and Rice" formula, but instead a "Chicken, Rice, Barley and Peas" formula)
Old Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/chicken-and-rice/dry.html
New Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/chicken-and-rice/dry2.html

Canidae Lamb & Rice
New Formula: http://canidae.com/dogs/lamb-and-rice/dry.html
The old formula has already been overwritten. "Lamb and Rice" formula will now also be a misnomer - even though it's legal as far as labeling regulations go. This is the current ingredient list:


Lamb Meal, Brown Rice, Canola Oil (preserved with Mixed Tocopherols), Flax Seed, Sun cured Alfalfa Meal, Sunflower Oil, Lamb, Lecithin, Potassium Chloride, Choline Chloride, Linoleic Acid, Rosemary Extract, Sage Extract, Dried Enterococcus Faecium Fermentation Product, Dried Lactobacillus Acidophilus Fermentation Product, Dried Aspergillus Oryzae Fermentation Extract, Dried Bacillus Subtilis Fermentation Extract, Inulin (from Chicory Root), Saccharomyces Cerevisiae Fermentation Solubles, L-Lysine, Taurine, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Mixed Tocopherols (source of Vitamin E), Zinc Amino Acid Chelate, Manganese Amino Acid Chelate, Iron Amino Acid Chelate, Copper Amino Acid Chelate, Cobalt Amino Acid Chelate, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Ascorbic Acid (source of Vitamin C), Niacin, Thiamine Mononitrate (Vitamin B1), Riboflavin (source of Vitamin B2), Beta Carotene, Calcium Pantothenate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Calcium Iodate, Folic Acid, D-Biotin, Organic Selenium, Dried Papaya, Dried Pineapple, Vitamin B12 Supplement
END QUOTE



** Moved by mod to existing thread **
URL and quotes added

I recently switched from Canidae to something else. I bought a new bag (canidae lamb & rice) about a month ago and to my surprise the kibble inside looked quite different. Shortly after beginning to feed it, one of my dogs (the one with the more sensitive digestive system) started having soft stools and more gastric noises. We finished the bag... partly because I couldn't afford to throw it all away, and partly because I wasn't sure that the food was the cause. I switched over to Natural Balance sweet potato & venison and the soft stools, etc. went away. Still don't know for sure if it was the food, but they seem to be doing well on the new brand regardless.

edit: I should also add that they started chowing down on the new stuff without any coaxing from me. I did do the slow switchover just in case, but they would eat the NB and leave the Canidae for later.