Re: "William's Issues"
[Re: Aaron Myracle ]
#201025 - 07/08/2008 01:41 PM |
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I agree that this dog needs help, but he also needs someone experienced to help out with this problem, with that person actually BEING there to SEE it. I have spoken to Karen on the phone, and from what was described to me, she is actually handling the aggressive behavior pretty well, it is just not enough. The correction with the DD collar worked for a time, but not enough to stop the behavior. Which to me says the correction wasn't strong enough. However, when you are already choking out the dog, and it is still not enough, and you are inexperienced yourself, it is time to get more help.
When a flower doesn't bloom, you fix the environment in which it grows, not the flower. |
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Re: "William's Issues"
[Re: Kacie Maffitt ]
#201027 - 07/08/2008 01:49 PM |
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She could split his food into small portions and feed him one portion each time he goes in the crate (to make sure he goes in without a fight). Cover it so he can't see her and ignore him until it is time to get him out again. Make sure he is being polite before she opens the door.
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Re: "William's Issues"
[Re: Debbie Bruce ]
#201030 - 07/08/2008 01:56 PM |
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the more you screw around with the food, the worse it gets...
When a flower doesn't bloom, you fix the environment in which it grows, not the flower. |
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Re: "William's Issues"
[Re: Cameron Feathers ]
#201032 - 07/08/2008 02:03 PM |
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Re: "William's Issues"
[Re: Debbie Bruce ]
#201116 - 07/09/2008 10:14 AM |
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Just a thought, but have you had a vet do a complete examination of him? Before going through everything you will have to go through to try and keep a dog like this, you may want to see if there is a medical cause. This is a whole lot of aggression from a 10 month old dog, and it's not the normal dominant stuff either. Dominant dogs don't roll over and then lose their minds. Provided everything is O.K. medically, I agree 100% with the muzzle. I disagree 100% with an e-collar. A prong can work in conjunction with a DD collar, but only if you are able to be effective with a single correction. I would put him through a few weeks (maybe a month) of deprivation. Crate to outside to potty, some exercise and back to crate. Feed him in his crate, but he has to repetitively lay down for every bite on command. Then he is tethered to you at all times. Through all of this you need to have a "matter of fact" attitude. No emotions whatsoever. His aggression does not get any rise out of you AT ALL, and it definitely does not cause fear (which is why muzzling is key). Resist the urge to hang the crap out of the dog all of the time, or fight with him. This is mental, and MENTAL strength is what you need to show. Good luck, this is not easy.
John
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Re: "William's Issues"
[Re: Aaron Myracle ]
#201121 - 07/09/2008 10:33 AM |
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Thank you all so much for you input, I value your help. Here is the update on William so far this week. I took Camron's advise and moved William's crate into the spare bedroom from the livingroom. I have been keeping him in the crate the entire time he is in the apartment.
I have started to take him for a 2 mile walk every day when I get home from work to tire him out. I want to try to do this in the AM as well before work, I will just have to start getting up earlier. I do walk him around my complex 2-3 other times every day as well. which is about 1/2 mile each time.
I am feeding him in the crate but he hasn't been eating too much since I moved him, I guess he will when he gets hungry. When I bring him in from outside I remove the prong collar and bring him to the kitchen on leash to his water.
Then immediately walk him to his crate, and as I get about 3' away I remove the leed and he walks directly into the crate. When I close the door he turns around and growls and barks at me and bares teeth. I just walk away and close the bedroom door and ignore him. He stops making noise right away, so I am not sure of what he is thinking.
I have removed all toys and I am not giving him any affection or attention, I am just taking him out and putting him away basically ignoring him, and it is really hard but I know it is for his own good because I love him I will do what it takes.
Today is day 3 in the other room and he still growls at me when I close the door but he stops as I walk out of the room, I think it will get better if I stay strong.
Thanks,
Karen
William and Luke |
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Re: "William's Issues"
[Re: Karen Flynn ]
#201122 - 07/09/2008 10:45 AM |
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Yes I have had the vet do a full work up on him which was recommended by Kacie. There are no medical issues, he is perfectly healthy.
He is not aggressive outside at all and he is as sweet as can be to other people and dogs. He crys and wiggles to see anyone and other dogs. I have not let him play or carry a stick when walking and I have avoided people with him because they want to pet him.
He only shows this aggression inside the apartment over bones or when I put him in the crate.
This crate business started when he was about 6 months old and he has been crate trained since I got him at 3 months old.
William and Luke |
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Re: "William's Issues"
[Re: Karen Flynn ]
#201123 - 07/09/2008 10:47 AM |
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One thing to think of, is to not walk away from the crate until he stops growling. Just stay there without showing any emotion so you are not rewarding the aggression by walking away. Just a thought.
John
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Re: "William's Issues"
[Re: John J. Miller ]
#201124 - 07/09/2008 10:49 AM |
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Feed him in his crate, but he has to repetitively lay down for every bite on command.
How in the world would she even enforce that???
Screwing with a dog's food doesn't enforce pack leader status.
It's just being a bully.
In a wolf pack, the alpha wolf eats his fill, and then he leaves the kill, and lets the lower wolves eat in peace. He doesn't hang around screwing with them.
Feeding in a crate is a good thing, because it lets the dog know you aren't going to mess with him or his food while he is eating.
Screwing around with a dog's food just makes them anxious, suspicious, and it tells the dog that you aren't fair. A pack leader is firm, consistant, and fair.
Games like this just reenforce food aggression, because it validates the dog's need to protect his meal.
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Re: "William's Issues"
[Re: Aaron Myracle ]
#201125 - 07/09/2008 10:59 AM |
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How in the world would she even enforce that???
Screwing with a dog's food doesn't enforce pack leader status.
It's just being a bully.
In a wolf pack, the alpha wolf eats his fill, and then he leaves the kill, and lets the lower wolves eat in peace. He doesn't hang around screwing with them.
Feeding in a crate is a good thing, because it lets the dog know you aren't going to mess with him or his food while he is eating.
Screwing around with a dog's food just makes them anxious, suspicious, and it tells the dog that you aren't fair. A pack leader is firm, consistant, and fair.
Games like this just reenforce food aggression, because it validates the dog's need to protect his meal.
She enforces this by keeping the food outside of the crate with her. The dog is muzzled and must lay down, then he gets food. Basically you are hand feeding the dog and making the dog lay down for each bite. Millions of handlers around the world handle the teaching phase of training most exercises with food, and the dogs do not lose their mind. I am not saying to give the dog the food in a bowl and then screw with it, I am saying to make the dog work for his food while conditioning him to understand that the food comes directly from her and that good things happen in his crate provided he listens to her and does not show aggression. If he does not comply or if he shows aggression he does not get the food.
John
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