Re: Mulberry Suspends Police Dog Program
[Re: randy allen ]
#204784 - 08/06/2008 11:37 PM |
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I think anytime this happens there should be a thorough investigation and I don't blame the public for being concerned but often they let their emotions get the better of them .
We have 21 K9's in our unit and we have heat sensors in all the cars . For the most part they work well . But sometimes they become tempermental . Wiring these things should be easy but it doesn't always work out that way . One of mine used to go off while I was driving . The windows would go down and horn go off for no reason . They tried several times to fix it . I'd go back out on the street thinking it was fixed and eventually the same problem would arise . Eventually we replaced the whole unit and the same problem occurred .
I don't know enough about what happened in this situation but my first reaction was ; " There but for the grace of God go I . " .
Our squads are equipped with heat sensors , tinted windows and we have a bucket of water in the back for the K9's . Some Officers also add fans into the squad at their own cost . We try to park our squads in shaded areas whenever possible . We also know the heat sensor is not 100% reliable but a mechanical device that can fail like any other so we try to check on our K9's whenever possible if they have been left unattended .
We haven't lost a K9 in this way in the 17 years I've been a Police Officer . But , sadly what that means to me is we are overdue . Mechanical things fail and bad things happen no matter what you do .
This type of thing happens very rarely across the country considering the large number of Police K9's that are working . I think this should tell people that the most Police Depts. are doing a good job in preventing this .
I will agree with those that say this type of thing shouldn't happen . But people being victimized by dangerous criminals shouldn't happen either but it does . Unfortunately Police K9's are put at risk everyday , searching for violent criminals or just sitting in the squad . But benefits that come from using Police K9' far out weigh the risks .
Hopefully with this case and the ones that are sure to come later , the public is able to get control of their emotions and look at each case objectively .
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Re: Mulberry Suspends Police Dog Program
[Re: Rob Nash ]
#204786 - 08/06/2008 11:52 PM |
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No Rob,
Yes, we are talking about the monies involved, but it is in the context of sadness at the waste. A wasted life for something as mundane as money.
Randy
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Re: Mulberry Suspends Police Dog Program
[Re: randy allen ]
#204795 - 08/07/2008 07:11 AM |
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Hi Jim,
In this case I think the vehicle wasn't equipped at all. That's just complete non-feasance. We lost one about 20 years ago before there were K9 alarm systems widely available. The officer was publicly evicerated and there was talk of criminal charges being filed against him. Fortunately cooler heads prevailed and a valuable lesson was learned. Since then all the K9 vehicles have been equipped with the alarm.
I was at a traffic control point in my Crown Vic one evening. Crown Vics have a regular problem with the electric radiator fans going out from temp sensors that fail. My car was pouring out smoke and the interior was like a sauna in no time due to hot air being blown in by the AC fan. The damn alarm didn't go off and fortunately I was nearby so I got the dog out in time. Had a citizen not alerted me to the problem I may not have been there in time. It can, and does happen. The heartache and devastation in losing a dog accidentally should not be compounded by citizens demanding the handler's head for something they may not have been able to prevent.
Howard
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Re: Mulberry Suspends Police Dog Program
[Re: Howard Knauf ]
#204842 - 08/07/2008 12:53 PM |
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Well Howard you know how it is with us darn cops. We drive too fast; unless of course we are on the way to someone in trouble. Then of course that person wonders what took so long. We shouldn't be writing that person a ticket; don't we know there are criminals out there to catch. I don't need to move over for flashing lights, well unless they are coming to help me. You would expect us to think that these darn dogs are nothing but a tool. We don't really care much about them. It's no wonder we don't take care of them properly. You know how it is. Darn cops. I'm glad I'm one of those that have never made a mistake or bad judgement call. I'll be glad to show the nail scars if anyone is interested.
DFrost
Any behavior that is reinforced is more likely to occur again. |
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Re: Mulberry Suspends Police Dog Program
[Re: David C.Frost ]
#204848 - 08/07/2008 01:58 PM |
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Just to add a few things. You were correct in saying the heat sensor was not installed yet, they say they had one on order.
However, they have had the dog for a few months already, I want to say they got him in April, why would it take that long for them to order one? Also, the community is in such an outrage because there was a fund raiser sponsored by the local Walmart in which the community pretty much paid for the dog. Such a shame, such a young dog.
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Re: Mulberry Suspends Police Dog Program
[Re: Laura Dobson ]
#204849 - 08/07/2008 02:11 PM |
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... they have had the dog for a few months already, I want to say they got him in April, why would it take that long for them to order one?
That's the thing; we don't know. For example, did they order it but it was out of stock?
There might be a whole story that was not in any newspaper account.
It is indeed a shame, though, and sad. I imagine that it is terrible for the handler.
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Re: Mulberry Suspends Police Dog Program
[Re: Howard Knauf ]
#204856 - 08/07/2008 03:48 PM |
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I caught the part about the vehicle not being equipped with the heat sensor and it concerns me. I just don't know enough about what was going on with the delay in getting it put in or any other factors that may have been involved .
Now hearing that the dog was purchased by the community makes me think everyone moved too fast in getting this dog out on the street . I've seen smaller departments get in over their head like this . A K9's offerred to the department everyone is excited , the media's covering it and it's going to be a great PR event for everyone . Then the department realizes there are alot of other costs related to the K9 . Squad , K9 insert for back of squad , large kennel , traing for the K9, vet care , leashes , sleeves , other training equipment. Now the departments scrambling . Their budget is not going to cover it . They may have to beg borrow and plead with the mayor , city council etc.(egos and redtape).
They don't want to lose the chance at getting this K9 because if they put it off they may lose out . The people offerring it may go to someone else . The Sheriff's Dept. , fire department , etc. I've seen plenty of charitable offerings and I can tell you the groups want to spend that money right away and get their time in the spotlight because it helps them raise even more money .
So the department gets enough together , usually the squad(often times the older one in their fleet) , K9 insert for the back of the squad and they get the dog out on the street for the public to see. They then work on getting the rest of the equipment .
Did the department and public have good intentions but move too fast or was it laziness and neglect . I just don't have enough information on this case to comment specifically on it . Either way it should be looked at and corrected . People should be disciplined if found to be at fault or procedures changed if that was the leading factor . But storming the Police Department , calling for officers jobs before the facts are is not the proper way to deal with this .
My point in my first post was ; We can't guarantee our K9 partners safety because the job itself is risky , either searching for badguys or simply sitting in the back of a squad car . We can do everthing in our power to keep our K9 partners safe during a search for badguys by using safe tactics or while he is in the back of our squad car , by checking on him , having the right equipment , keeping that equipment in good order , etc. but something could happen and we could lose our partners anyways . Partners we love , care for , are part of our families and go out and put our lives on the line together for the public .
Unfortunately , as sure as other Police K9's will die out pursuing badguys or simply sitting in a squad car , the public will jump up while we are mourning the lose of our partners and demand we lose our jobs or our freedom , before they have the facts .
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Re: Mulberry Suspends Police Dog Program
[Re: David C.Frost ]
#204861 - 08/07/2008 04:15 PM |
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David , how about some Police K9 related complaints . Your window tint is illegal , your squad is running unattended , you don't actually leave your dog in there do you? , while pointing at a fully marked K9 squad with dog barking in back .
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Re: Mulberry Suspends Police Dog Program
[Re: Jim Nash ]
#204863 - 08/07/2008 04:27 PM |
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So, a little googling leads to this:
The "official" report:
http://lledit.ny.publicus.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080806/NEWS/808060384/
What's missing from the "official" report?
http://www.theledger.com/article/20080807/NEWS/808070354&title=Mulberry_s_Grade__Incomplete
Why was Diesel in the patrol car in the first place?
A Ledger reader passed along a tip that The Ledger waited to ask about until after the report was finished: Word on the street was that Police Chief Larry Cavallaro had told the officer to take Diesel from the building because he smelled badly.
The report didn't address why Diesel was in the car. Asked Monday about the lead from the tipster, Cavallaro said: "Some dogs don't smell so good. He said he told Officer Ricky Booher, a patrol supervisor - and the author of the report - to tell Movahedi to get Diesel out of the building because he smelled. Cavallaro acknowledged to Ledger reporter Rick Rousos that bringing the dog back into the station that day was not an option. The dog was going to be taken to the veterinarian about the problem.
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Re: Mulberry Suspends Police Dog Program
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#204864 - 08/07/2008 04:32 PM |
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I'd like to iterate for the record; I would not be one of the people storming the doors of the local precinct, I would however be one of the more powerful group that would be (for days and weeks after the mad mob mentality had returned to the latest daily celeb) demanding to know why these two officers were put on the street without the proper equipment. If for no other reason then to hear the administrator in charge say, 'I'm sorry, I made a mistake. I will not ever ask the same from other officer, man or beast. All officers will be deployed with the proper back up from here on out.'
Unsatisfactory as that out come may be; the only way any politican will ever do the right thing is if we hold their feet to the fire and make them accountable for how they conduct our interests. We're not all following the latest star search winner. Let them know, we're watching. We care.
Tell them to stop cutting corners, it's already hard of enough of a job on the street without a slacker on the inside undermining the effort.
Randy
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