Quote: steve strom

Now I get it, it's all in the delivery. If I smile and say " oh my goodness, hide the milkbones" It's not as confrontational as " holy ****, hide the milkbones" while laughing out loud.

Also, running away while screaming "Hide the baby and the lock the 'fridge!" is not so good.



You know what's hilarious?

The two people I know who are most adamantly opposed to the food rewards in marker training ("All those TREATS??!!") happen to have barrels on legs for dogs.

But with much repetition and example, I have finally actually gotten it across to one of them that the rewards are part of the diet, and not "in addition to" the diet. Apparently, that's a very difficult concept to grasp.



I went to a meeting of a club of mostly Pugs last week with my dogs and showed them some marker training basics. One of the most fascinating aspects to the owners, oddly, was the size of the rewards.

I had a bait bag** full of Zuke's minis, Grizzly Nu, and Simon and Huey's*, plus M&M-size bits of string cheese and no-chemical turkey dogs, and a little leftover cooked beef in pieces the size of half a fingernail. A wonderful slot machine, to a dog!

I gathered that "treats," prior to this, had had a meaning of Milk Bone size, and also of Milk Bone quality --- junk food for dogs.

I passed out handfuls to try the marker-loading and showed how the reward did not necessitate stopping and waiting while the dog either dragged it off to eat in private or stood there chewing for two minutes.



It brought home to me why Ed demonstrates a couple of times in the marker article as well as in the "training with food" articles what size the rewards should be. It had not occurred me that people would be rewarding with a chicken drumstick.



I admit that I am very lazy and that I keep the whole bait bag, loaded, in the 'fridge, ready to grab on my way out.

I also have tiny dishes of the no-'fridge types around the house.

To anyone thinking about marker training (or even just rewarding with food, period), this really eliminates any reasons for not incorporating lil sessions into the day, every day, when teaching new behaviors.



And, back on topic , I used this whole thing as an intro to "better rather than more" as a feeding mantra for a chubbo, pointing out that food of an appropriate type, even if not raw, is not only infinitely more healthful, but is also infinitely more satisfying to the dog than a food that offers incomplete protein in a form not digested well by dogs with a ton of filler that's more calories than nutrition.


Long answer. But yes, I do think that we can help a poor blubber-butt dog who can hardly hoist himself off his bed and waddle to the dish. That is, if we are very careful to be non-judgmental and upbeat, and if we empathize ("Oh, yes, that breed is so food-driven!") and offer suggestions, we can. If we incite defensiveness, we are counterproductive.


All JMO, of course.



* http://leerburg.com/treat.htm

** http://leerburg.com/736.htm

 Quote: mallory kwiatkowski

..... asks us if they should go to a "weight control" food. i just recommend cutting back on the regular food first.

YES!

Here too, a recommendation of better (not "diet") food is in order.

For a blubber-butt, give the best food possible, and fluff up the bowl if necessary with some almost-no-cal greens like steamed broccoli tops or no-salt frozen or canned green beans to avoid the "OH NO!" look of heartbreak when the dog sees that 1/4 full dish with that no-meat crap in it.

Treats of skinless white poultry diced into M&M size bits are great. So are those canned green beans (which dogs, oddly, seem to love).

Last time I visited my mom and step-dad in Florida, the first thing I said was "Oh my God! She's HUGE" about their little Aussie/lab mix. I felt terrible, but it just came out.

Fortunately, they love their dog so much that her health is their first priority. They had been over feeding her a bit to make sure she had enough to eat (she's a rescue dog) and hadn't realized she had porked up so much. After I talked to them about it (feeling horrid all the while) they switched her to a better diet, and less of it, and she's been slowly losing weight since. They would do ANYTHING for their dog, and were flexible and willing to change what they were doing if it would benefit her. They are so incredibly good to her. All dogs should be so lucky! (Oh, and they received their first Leerburg catalogue a couple weeks ago ) . They just didn't realize she had become overweight.

I think sometimes people get so used to seeing overweight dogs that they don't have a realistic picture of what their dog is supposed to look like. I don't believe people intentionally let their dogs get fat most of the time, they just don't want to 'deprive' them. I wouldn't be able to say anything to a stranger, but have no problem telling someone I know well that they may not want to "love" their dog with food, and ultimately 'love' them to an early grave.

Good for them!

Too many owners are using food to substitute for real care (exercise, playing, and training).

JMHO.

connie and sarah, that's a smart, non-confrontational way to address it

i have to admit, when i adopted teagan, she was overweight, and i was very defensive about it. whenever someone would say 'what a nice-looking dog' i'd end up blurting out 'i JUST adopted her! she's on a diet! and getting lots of exercise!'....then they'd look at me like i was crazy nobody ever said anything to me, but i was sure that everyone thought 'look at how she's let that dog get!' probably b/c i do look at how in-shape dogs appear.

Kristel is totally right. People are used to fat dogs. I get the weirdest looks when I tell people that my dog is a labrador. Granted, he appears to be (and act) like field lines and I know that most show-line labs look a little more portly naturally, but I always get: "But he's so SKINNY!"

You are right about "not seeing" the dog as fat. My CeeCee is a lean, mean, minpin machine, and my husband worries that she's too skinny. Harley is overweight, and hubby just can't see it. They both (the dogs) are being raw fed, very few treats, and those are home made, or ordered from Leerburg. I just cannot get it through his head that he needs to stop sharing everyhing he eats with Harley, not so much CeeCee as my girl doesn't beg. I've told Norman if he would just ignore Harley a few times, that Harley would stop pestering him. Harley certainly doesn't pester me,as he knows it won't do any good anyway. But he (Norman) says, but he looks so hungry. ARG.