I also have a malamute who groans/growls when we are training or when he is being rubbed. My GSD growls all the time. When she plops down on the floor to relax or when my puppy bothers her. Every GSD that I have owned was very vocal, always moaning and growling.

Pack Leadership-I have read,and I actually never knew this, and I am sure someone will rip me a new one if they disagree.You said your husband gives them equal attention. From what I understand you always need to give the dominant dog attention first. This may seem unfair by human standards, however dogs have no sense of equality. Always pet the dominant dog first whenever both dogs approach. When taking them out for a walk, attach the lead to the dominant dog first. If the lower ranking dog pushes in, ignore him and continue what you are doing. Feed the dominant dog his meal and treats first. Theses small actions send signals to the dogs that you, as alpha, are aware of their pack status.

Lisa,
It is hard to decide which dog of ours is more dominant. For that reason, we do not try to sort it out - sometimes we will put Roxie's food in her crate first, and sometimes it will be Nickie who gets fed first. When they come and go thru the patio door, we go in first and they follow (sometimes Roxie first, sometimes Nickie).

From what I've been led to believe, it only matters that we are the dominant pack leaders - we should have no concern about the ranking of the two dogs - just that they are "under" us.

Diane,

Work on the pack structure; it is never the wrong thing to do . My dog "purrs" which is pretty growly but is usually accompanied by rolling around on his back or doing a happy dance when someone comes home etc. I don't even notice it anymore but he has been doing it since his voice changed at about a year and a half.

I am assuming you have had Roxie for awhile and know her well? If so, this growl is probably new since your husband alerted to it right away? With that being said I think body language is hugely important to try to determine what you are dealing with. See if your husband can describe what her body language was like? If it happens in your presence be as objective as possible when gauging her body language. I would also note where Nickie is when this has occurred and what her reaction is.

Until I was 100% confident it is a benign behavior; I would take precautions and hone up on the old pack structure building.

Sheila,

When I have seen & heard Roxie "growl" it is when she is sitting on the floor looking very relaxed. Sometimes I have seen & heard her do it while she is in her crate - again just lying down but looking towards one of us. Usually when this happens Nickie is either sleeping in his crate or once was on the couch sleeping next to me (he is only on the couch when he is "invited". We give a little more leeway for Roxie who sleeps on the couch if she is out of her crate. We still have to keep eyes on Nickie 100% when he is out of his crate due to him occasionally trying to get into stuff. After re-reading this, I don't think that Roxie views the couch as "hers" and thus growls if she sees Nickie on the couch. Many times they will sleep side by side on the couch with one of us at the end with absolutely no problems. (Again, Nickie is only allowed up if we say so).

 Quote: lisa harrison

Pack Leadership-I have read,and I actually never knew this, and I am sure someone will rip me a new one if they disagree .You said your husband gives them equal attention. From what I understand you always need to give the dominant dog attention first. This may seem unfair by human standards, however dogs have no sense of equality. Always pet the dominant dog first whenever both dogs approach. When taking them out for a walk, attach the lead to the dominant dog first. If the lower ranking dog pushes in, ignore him and continue what you are doing. Feed the dominant dog his meal and treats first. Theses small actions send signals to the dogs that you, as alpha, are aware of their pack status.

Allow me! Seriously, this might work if every single person knew with absolute certainty who was the alpha. But YOU as the human are supposed to be the alpha. As the alpha, your role is to get respect, and make sure others respect each other. They don't have to like each other, but they are not permitted to fight. I think the alpha/person needs to stay far away from trying to determine which dog is the alpha. You are asking for trouble, and I think you could actually cause it by favoring one dog over another. How many times have you seen a dog get pushy b/c another dog was getting more attention? Not saying that you need to treat them completely equally-they are all individuals-but getting involved w/canine pack behavior when you THINK you know what's going on is dangerous, IMHO. Most people get it wrong. People in general suck at reading dogs. How many dog bites are caused by people not reading or misreading a dog? How many times do people blame the wrong dog in an altercation?

I don't think there is necessarily a "right" or a "wrong" universally, but I do think most people would be in WAY over their heads to even attempt to maintain a certain order amongst their dogs. Someone very experienced is a different story.

I agree with Jenni. A dominant animal is, by definition, an animal that is in control of resources. And that dominant animal should be you.

Many people think that dog A is dominant when actually he's just a bully or a fearful resource guarder or any of a number of reasons that a dog could be acting "tough." A truly dominant animal is confident and usually has nothing to prove because he doesn't often get challenged. For most people, IMO, just trying to be the dominant leader to a single animal is enough of a challenge that trying to figure out the subtle nuances between other dogs in the pack just gets them into trouble.

 Quote: sheila buckley

Until I was 100% confident it is a benign behavior; I would take precautions and hone up on the old pack structure building.

And Dianne, I agree with this too, since you did say that you are already of the opinion that your dogs do not respect you. Better safe than sorry, right?

 Quote: diane joslin

Roxie was across the room watching us and did her little growl after a few minutes. I told her to "come" and she came up to me for a little pat on the head.

And even if the growling is only an attention-getter, I would still make sure that i didn't let that become a pushy, demanding behavior.

 Quote: jenni williams

People in general suck at reading dogs. How many dog bites are caused by people not reading or misreading a dog? How many times do people blame the wrong dog in an altercation?

I couldn't agree more! I would say that 75% of the people that email me daily about their dog's aggression say that the dog is "unpredictable" or bites "without warning". If they can't see the subtle signs (change in breathing, posture, ears and eyes) then there is no way they can see which dog is actually instigating the situation.

I think it's best for the average owner to treat the dogs as subordinates, period. (Regardless of their pack structure and rank with each other.)

 Quote: cindy easton rhodes

 Quote: jenni williams

People in general suck at reading dogs. How many dog bites are caused by people not reading or misreading a dog? How many times do people blame the wrong dog in an altercation?

I couldn't agree more! I would say that 75% of the people that email me daily about their dog's aggression say that the dog is "unpredictable" or bites "without warning". If they can't see the subtle signs (change in breathing, posture, ears and eyes) then there is no way they can see which dog is actually instigating the situation.

I think it's best for the average owner to treat the dogs as subordinates, period. (Regardless of their pack structure and rank with each other.)

though to be fair, without experience, those signs are hard to pick up (i just say that b/c when i got teagan, i had NO clue, it took me some time to learn to read her. now it's like watching neon lights, but when i first adopted her, not at all).

diane, when i first got teagan, i treated her as the dominant dog (given that luc would submit to the pillsbury doughboy though, it wasn't really something i had to think about). b/c she can be a bit off a snot, b/c i adopted neb, and b/c i decided that if i was in charge, i shouldn't have to be giving privileges to a specific dog, i started mixing up privileges like first feeding, through doors, etc. i don't treat any of my dogs the same, b/c they've all got different personalities, but i stopped worrying about enforcing their internal dog structure. when they're all out together, i expect them all to defer to me anyways; i don't want or need a doggy second-in-command. but i'm definitely not an experienced owner either.

 Quote: cindy easton rhodes

... I think it's best for the average owner to treat the dogs as subordinates, period.

Or as Cesar Millan phrases it: "They know their pack position. They are Number Two."

Connie,

I agree they are #2.I think the book I read this info in (Colin Tennant) was referring to interpack aggression, not pack structure in general. (Maybe I read too many books!)

Cindy,

I agree,the average dog owner does not know how to read their dog.

Jenni,
I knew someone would come thru for me! LOL!