What do they do outside in the fenced acres? Not running around loose as a pack? We could go for walks on the trail and do on-leash training in the open areas. For any kind of off-leash work we'd have to drive. How much off-leash time outside would a dog need? How many times a day? There are some baseball fields nearby, locked. Our 3 dogs don't go off leash at all, we use 80' climbing accessory cord for fetch and recall. Bathroom is outside in the 10x30, I clean up several times a day. I've been looking at something like this to install downstairs. It'll provide a semi-decent indoor training space.

When my dogs are not in their "pen" which is often, they are outside with me or inside with me. Sometimes crated, sometimes loose in the house. We play, walk, do yard work. I drive them to secluded areas and we do day hikes with swimming.

I am a firm believer that dogs need to run, and not running beside a bicycle run. I mean all out tumble and jump and have fun run, it keeps them sane.

We do big, all out run 3-5 times a week. OBD, Agility, and ScH training sessions 3-5 times a week and yard play in between, or when it is super cold and they are only going to last 20 mins or so.

I take the higher drive dogs out 3-4 times a day to do short leashed walks with OBD, so I get up between 5:30-6:00am and go to bed at 10pm.

Keep in mind, just because one person thinks owning multiple dogs is hard, doesn't mean that for you it will be. It depends on what each persons definition of hard is. I don't find it hard, but it is a lot of work, but I am committed to my dogs and their needs so I make sacrifices. I have a friend that kennels dogs in her home, no outdoor kennels. She drives to secluded areas EVERYDAY to let them run, sometimes 9 dogs, all in control. For her it's the usual day, for others it would be too hard.

I guess there are 2 sides to the outside space problem:

1. An outside kennel. Does it have something to do with the dog having to be alone, outside and out of sight and hearing of the pack for some training-related reason? Or is it simply for the convenience of the owner?

2. Fenced-in outside area where the dog is off-leash. Is it because the amount of off-leash training required is such that it would be impractical to walk or drive that many times a day? I am considering a Malinois, so that a 6' fence(the legal limit here) won't keep the dog 100% secure.

Dear forum members, your help is of a greatest value. I am not even looking at the pups online before everybody is absolutely certain we can do it.

Oops, I typed while you posted Great points. I will try to find a big secluded area nearby. There are plenty of fields and meadows, none of them fenced, but many of them very secluded. Those baseball fields are starting to look very tempting.

We are getting up at 7am for 1hr walk+training and do another 1hr walk+training at 6pm with short sessions throughout a day.

I have had at the least four dogs my entire life, and find what others have posted as being very true. I lost my two senior dogs last year within months apart, and later was sent a service dog pup for training, I was also on a list for a new GSD pup for this spring. I figured that would give me about 6 more months to work with the service dog, instead, the breeder called in November saying they had the "perfect" GSD pup for my therapy program...now two pups! One with lots of energy and drive, one so soft that I was finding him difficult to work with. Even with this horrible New England winter, now that we are all on a routine, everything is fine!

I am not doing ScH training, but I know it is very time consuming, what Steve suggested will give you a better idea
if it is something you can manage.

I have 6 in the house. Really of the dogs I have the biggest step change for me was from 2 to 3 when I really started to see a behavior shift in my 2nd dog. If you have the time, then I say go for it. Personally I prefer a 2 to 3 year gap between new dogs which allows them to get to adulthood mentally. I also allow no interaction between my youngest dog and my older dogs. This means in the case of my youngest Rain that she pottys, walks, eats, trains, and plays either with me or alone. She is also crated in a room away from the other dogs.

I know it sounds strict but my goal is a human bonded housedog, not a pack bonded one.

4 is much harder than 3 if the dogs have a little uummpp to them, they don't always get along.

 Quote: Al Curbow

4 is much harder than 3 if the dogs have a little uummpp to them, they don't always get along.

This is my biggest concern. The second dog, Suzie, is reactive - somebody bumps into her, she'll show teeth. Bit more tolerant of the new male than our first female, whom she had a fight with in Nov. She's ok as long as they leave her alone. The young male, Monty, always wants to play with everybody, so I'm teaching him to play only with me. It's getting better with the OB and making the rules very clear. Have to get this perfect before we go further.

 Quote: Melissa Thom

...with me or alone. She is also crated in a room away from the other dogs.

I'm not sure a dog could be 100% isolated on our property, will always hear the others and see them often. I was thinking maybe introducing to everybody and teaching to ignore? If we get any further, I'll get the 8wks-8mo and Raising working pup DVDs.

A good drivey dog is supposedly much easier to train than a pet-quality one. Would it be easier or harder to make a good house dog out of him? With our male I could almost always redirect him with a toy and the 2nd female couldn't care less about toys and even food sometimes. Makes it more difficult to teach her anything.

If I were to get a 4th pet(no way) I would do whatever it takes to make him a good companion/pack member first and worry about drives second. With a sports prospect, I understand, a lot of qualities have to be carefully preserved and developed. But then Cindy and Rush just won and she says all her dogs are good house dogs. How can I find out if I got what it takes to achieve that before we get knee-deep in cute puppies?

Hi Ana,

Why not work with what you've got first, see if you can turn up drives in one of the dogs you currently have? What an education that would be, for you and the dog.

Just thinking out loud.

Meredith