Kojak:

“Can you please give a little more detail in what you might consider, "positive"”

Positive means different things to different dogs. To some it means:

-To fight
-To get it’s prey
-To relieve stress
-To dominate
-To please it’s owner
-To eat
-To go into drive
-Ect…

An important step in knowing your dog is to know which one is more important to him. A vital part in Bernard’s retrieve tape is when he shows his dog a ball and a dumbbell and asks him which one he chooses. This is such an important step! The more valuable one of the above is to a dog the more motivation a dog has to fulfill his part of the contract – “You do what I want and you get...(insert one of the above).”

positive for me was getting my last dog to stop peeing on my leg. Nothing worse then a squiter.

Robert

Kojak:

I'm surprised you did not reply to my post. I had the feeling that your question had an agenda more than seeking information. You seem too secure in your training to just throw out a question like that. Am I way off base?

Well Thank you Vince,

No, I did not have an agenda nor was I trying to be leading. I truly was looking for a clear answer. I guess I should have started with a clearer question.

But with that said, I do agree on the angle and responce you gave to the question of what is "positive". Yes, Positive was and could be all that you mentioned, However, I guess I needed a better question in relation to the socialization tips people were giving.

I am not of the mind set of letting or leading my puppy around with treats saying hello to everyone I meet. Nor am I in the habit of letting my little puppies play with each other just to blow off steam or meet a new friend. Our view of socialization, or you may even call it our difinition is, Work your dogs in and around all social situations. A dog undercontrol, at any age, working in a social situation is true socialization.
I don't seek out other dogs first the friendly then so on and so on. We look for unique social situations then work the dog in, around, over and metaphorically through the situation. We release and then call it a day.
I know I have rambled a bit but I guess I'm still looking for my question in my own words.

Ok, Here it is. you are at petco, you have your dog on leash ready to explore, someone wants to pet your dog, Do you let them? if you do and the dog starts to nip them or so call play bite them, what is your next step. Thank you KOJAK

“No, I did not have an agenda nor was I trying to be leading. I truly was looking for a clear answer. I guess I should have started with a clearer question.”

I applaud your non defensive reply.

“I am not of the mind set of letting or leading my puppy around with treats saying hello to everyone I meet.”

No one under any circumstances feeds my dog anything but me.

“Nor am I in the habit of letting my little puppies play with each other just to blow off steam or meet a new friend.”

You and I are together on that one. I will take it a step further. It won’t happen.

“A dog undercontrol, at any age, working in a social situation is true socialization.”

Need you too expand on that one.

“We look for unique social situations then work the dog in, around, over and metaphorically through the situation.”

Bingo. Your prize awaits you at the front door.

“Here it is. you are at petco, you have your dog on leash ready to explore, someone wants to pet your dog, Do you let them?”

I would say to him, “My dog is in training, which means he is very mouthy. If biting, scratching or getting your close dirty and/or ripped will bother you I would rather you not pet my dog. Ok then just for a second and do not lift him off the ground please. Thanks. Good bye now.”

sssssss.....POP!!!(Proverbial can of worms)

If I am at Petco(isn't that a four letter word?), and someone wants to pet my pup they are immediatley told the pup will bite and will jump. If they don't like it. That's their problem if they don't like my rules. It is my puppy. It is my job to protect him. Not Joe Blow.

Everthing was great, except this

“My dog is in training, which means he is very mouthy. If biting, scratching or getting your close dirty and/or ripped will bother you I would rather you not pet my dog. Ok then just for a second and do not lift him off the ground please. Thanks. Good bye now.”

Why would you not follow through with the set up?
why would you allow the jump? Could we not use this as the control I mentioned before?

My quote would read " my dog is in training, if you would like to pet fine, however if he breaks his sit or jumps on you please take your hands be cause I will be redirecting my dog back into his position."

Does this help? Clear up what I think of forced socialization balanced and directed through the obedience?

Using the facilities of a petfood supermarket are wonderful training and socialization areas especially if you are limited to the "outside world" for exposures. Dallas is 19wks and growing bigger every day!

Not being able to work with Dallas outside on my day off because of weather; we drove the 45 minutes to PetSmart. Not only did we get in another ride in the truck but once there; she had the opportunity to meet more people!

We cruzed the iles practicing our heel, sit, stay and when I decided to check out the books and magazines; I put her in a down..and there she stayed till I decided to move on.

We met a lady at an isle crossing who asked if she could pet Dallas. I put her in a sit/stay and granted her request to meet Dallas. I expected her to do as I asked (which includes no mouthy biting and no jumping). Manners are included in our education.

We met several people that day doing the exact same thing and also met some who should have been. One man loudly proclaimed at the checkout area "how bad" his ill mannered mouthy jumping husky was that was jumping up on him and pulling him wherever the husky wanted to go. The lady who had wanted to pet him..suddenly changed her mind.

Manners go hand in hand with training.

Why would you not follow through with the set up?
why would you allow the jump? Could we not use this as the control I mentioned before?

Distraction training is always done with someone I know and discussed thoroughly before hand. I cannot count on a stranger acting correctly, which could reinforce a negative behavior. An example is when teaching the come with a pup. I have a friend play with my pup for a second or two and then I call him over. As soon as I say Come my friend stops petting and turns their head to the side while I am waiting with food and praise when he arrives.

“I expected her to do as I asked (which includes no mouthy biting and no jumping).”

That’s my point. What would you have done if she did not act accordingly? Too young to correct and you are not prepared for drive training. Never set yourself up for failure! Note my above text. Always set yourself up for success (ending positively).