Crystal,

This is kind of a shot in the dark, because it is not clear to me from the information that you provided so far how your dog behaves in social situations generally. How does your dog act in public places other than the vet's office? Do you take her out with you to places where she has the opportunity to become socialized to strangers? Is the fear/aggression limited to the vet's office, or does it come out other places as well?

If the problem is limited to the vet's office, the solution may be different than if she is generally aggressive. For example, if the vet's office is the only place where she has the problem, you may want to think about changing vets (if that is possible) and spending some time at the new vet's office in a purely social, non-treatment mode so that she comes to see the place and the staff non-threatening and friendly. For all we know, she may associate this particular place and/or these particular people with something unpleasant or frightening that was imprinted as a puppy -- hence the fear/agression. My vet is very cooperative with and encouraging of this kind of conditioning and socialization, although I don't know whether that is generally the case. I have a 100+ pound Tibetan mastiff who does not like to be treated, so I try to take him in from time to time just to say hello, step on the scale, get a treat, etc. It seems to help, although we still need to sedate him for some procedures. (It's not fun trying to lift him back into the car when we leave, though.) In my case, though, he has been extensively socialized in other environments and displays no aggression toward people or dogs elsewhere.

On the other hand, if your dog is also aggressive in other situations and places, then other measures would be necessary. I think we all need more information to help define the problem before anyone can really propose specific solutions to help you.

Bryan Veis

Originally posted by Lisa Swanston:
What kind of sedative does the vet use? Is it, by any chance, Acepromazine? I see no problem with using medication if it helps, but there are known problems with using Acepromazine for aggressive dogs. There may be a different medication that will be more effective, such as Valium or Xanax.

Lisa,

What known problems come from using Acepromazine?

She's non-agressive around strangers like at petco, or just around the neighborhood. I still ask people not to pet her, not knowing what her reaction will be.. I do know that one of my neighbors did try to pet her, and she backed up, but didn't growl or bark at her.. I'm searching for a good basket style muzzle for her.. Everyone I've tried hasn't fit properly.. And the Nylon style restricts her airway too much.. About the seditive they use, I'm not 100% sure what kind they use.. Tomorrow she's going in for a urine re-check after a bout of UTI.. That'll be my main starting point, they don't need to see her, but she can come & sit in the waiting room with me..

John,

Many dogs seem to be able to will themselves to overcome its effects, at least temporarily. This makes it less than ideal as a drug for dealing with aggressive or fearful dogs... Source: http://www.vetinfo.com/daggression.html#Acepromazine

Acepromazine is commonly used for infrequent anxietal episodes, but it may induce a paradoxical hyperactivity in some dogs and cats. Source: http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/190604.htm&hide=1

Acepromazine is a tranquilizer most often used prior to anesthesia and surgery. It does not provide any pain relief. It can be given orally or by injection. Dose varies widely between individuals. Can make aggressive tendencies worse or more unpredictable. Source: http://www.brentwoodpetclinic.com/veterinarymedications.html

Dogs that have had ACP can become 'disinhibited' so they can actually become more aggressive.

This is particularly important where fearfulness is involved; imagine what it must feel like to be frightened but out of control so that you cannot move properly or escape.
The dog's ability to protect itself using aggression remains unaffected and if it cannot move to get away then the only remaining choice may be to bite Source: http://www.cabtsg.org/ACP.html

Originally posted by Crystal Goens:
That'll be my main starting point, they don't need to see her, but she can come & sit in the waiting room with me.. That's good, but keep in mind that she may already have a strong enough negative association with the vet's office that just sitting in the waiting room will stress her beyond her ability to cope. You might consider starting with just leaving her in the car, and working up to being in the waiting room over a longer period of time. The progression might look something like:

Week 1: Sitting in car
Week 2: Getting out of car, then getting back in
Week 3: Getting out of car, practicing 1-2 obedience commands (using positive motivation and reward), then getting back in car
Week 4: Getting out of car, walking toward office, turn around and get back in car
Week 5: Getting out of car, walking toward office, sitting in front of door, then going back to car
Week 6: Getting out of car, sitting in front of office door, go inside office and immediately u-turn right back out, get back in car
Week 7: Go inside office, practice a sit, go back to car
Week 8: Go inside office, practice a sit, let office staff feed her a cookie, go back to car

And so on, breaking the whole experience down into its smallest components and building upon each successful repetition. You could go twice a week and practice each step, one at a time. As you can see it would be time consuming and would require a substantial commitment from you. I would also suggest that you talk to your vet about finding a sedative that works for your dog so that when she must be seen, she feels REALLY good. This will dovetail nicely with the training.

Thanks Lisa,

I was just curious........my vet sais they do not like to use Ace.

N/P. I wasn't aware of these issues until I had personal experience with Ace and one of my dogs. My vet prescribed it for her thunder/firework phobia. She has this phobic reaction where she will pace, pant, try to go through windows/screens, and squeeze herself into spaces way too small to accomodate her. She will NOT settle down, she shivers, and her heart rate is through the roof, for hours and hours on end. We used the Ace and found that it did not address her fear at all, just made her too groggy to move around much. I felt really bad for her because I could see that she was still totally panicked yet unable to do anything about it. Imagine being scared out of your gourd and totally paralyzed.
We switched to a different medication that works much better.

Well today Sassy sat in the car while I went inside the vets office.. She didn't react what so ever, she just got fired up when she say a cat walked by the car, but other then that, she was good.. So next time same thing again..

I have the same problem with Max. I took him to get nuetered, the vets insisted I leave him there in the morning and pick him up that afternoon. I gave him the ace and walked him till he was walking drunk, I put him in the cage and was directed to leave Max in thier "expert care". later that day they called and were quite upset. Max bit an assistant on the face and bit and held anothers hand. two vets came in to get Max under control but couln't. a third vet who had work with police GSD's before grabbed a hind leg and got an IV into him. I told them he was crate aggressive and a fear biter but I was pooh poohed told that they could handle him. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />