Kimberly;

Our responses here are not about respect or disrespect. No need to try to impress with your experience. There are a lot of people here with much more dog experience (and with multple breeds) than you. You came here asking for advice, and we gladly, cheerfully, respectfully obliged.

We don't give cookie cutter advice, because dogs are not cookies. They have souls, personalities, and develop issues based on their experiences and treatment. When someone asks here for advice, we want to know if there are contributing environmental factors.

Two things...

This is not your first BT. You say they are hard to train, yet you chose one with alpha tendencies to try to retrain into a social dog. You may have taught some pack structure and basic manners, but it's damned hard to untrain what was imprinted in this dog during the litter phase. As a behaviorist, you DO know that this is the most critical period for puppies, right?

All dogs are different, even within breeds, and there can always be exceptions. All of your previous BTs may have been social, but this dog may be the exception. Someone could get hurt if you're wrong, and then you're gonna PTS?

If you ask me for advice, you should be open-minded enough to accept it.
I have a feeling that this dog will be PTS.

 Quote: Duane Hull

Kimberly;

Our responses here are not about respect or disrespect. No need to try to impress with your experience. There are a lot of people here with much more dog experience (and with multple breeds) than you. You came here asking for advice, and we gladly, cheerfully, respectfully obliged.

We don't give cookie cutter advice, because dogs are not cookies. They have souls, personalities, and develop issues based on their experiences and treatment. When someone asks here for advice, we want to know if there are contributing environmental factors.

Two things...

This is not your first BT. You say they are hard to train, yet you chose one with alpha tendencies to try to retrain into a social dog. You may have taught some pack structure and basic manners, but it's damned hard to untrain what was imprinted in this dog during the litter phase. As a behaviorist, you DO know that this is the most critical period for puppies, right?

All dogs are different, even within breeds, and there can always be exceptions. All of your previous BTs may have been social, but this dog may be the exception. Someone could get hurt if you're wrong, and then you're gonna PTS?

If you ask me for advice, you should be open-minded enough to accept it.
I have a feeling that this dog will be PTS.

Good stuff, Duane. All Kimberly's ex-pounding credentials, let's try and be the nice group we know we are ()and just answer the question she is asking, which is how can she not reinforce the unwanted behavior and continue to be social. My best advice would be to not allow people to interact with her when she is doing the unwanted behavior. Until she acts appropriately (OB as others have stated), no touch, no talk, no eye contact.

Is the puppy lunging and acting aggressive or is she just voacalizing at this point? It didn't sound like she's actually being aggressive in your initial post- just that you are more afraid of "appearances" in the future when she's full grown and still doing this.

Some dogs are more vocal than others- and this can vary within the breed or even within a litter. Drift my GSD is a very vocal dog... always grumbling or sighing or groaning...

I don't let my dogs meet and greet others while socializing. When I am socializing, I am teaching the pup to be neutral to other people and animals in it's environment. When the dog is sufficiently neutral, I then will teach a "go see" command which lets the dog meet others.

While working toward the neutrality that I want, I keep the pup engaged with me when we are around others or in a public place - which teaches the pup that all good things will come from ME, and also teaches her that strange people and other animals won't hurt her so she doesn't have to worry about them.

I think if you work on engagement with you, the pup won't be so excited about strangers and other dogs- YOU will be what she wants to play with because YOU are the one who makes wonderful things happen, and YOU are the funest thing around.

Or am I reading this whole thing wrong?

PS- I have 2 working Therapy Dogs that were socialized in this way.

 Quote: Duane Hull

IMHO, she's a tad young for a "Firm correction".

Sounds to me, JMO,that she needs some desensitization, followed by not allowing her to greet people or dogs if she does make a display, period.

Sorry, Tanya... I forgot myself. The PTS thing caused me to overreact.

I've been kind of lurking. Initially I decided to not weigh in with my mindless prattle but in the end I find myself unable to exercise restraint.

The overly simplistic approach I too often elect to use, when confronted by a mutt with a mind of its own, is to simply work with the dog one on one until I am comfortable with our roles: I lead, it follows.

I work on basics, basics, basics until the dog anticipates a command or situation and acts accordingly. I walk, the dog walks. I stop, the dog stops and sits. That the dog understands fully the command 'no' or some variant, is a given.

I'm not interested in a super trained dog in the first instance. I expect to work through a gradually enlarged command set throughout the life of the dog. I expect the dog to respond to my cues.

That simple approach I use in the context of a spirited dog or as spirited as the dog is by nature, and within my situational boundaries.

I know there is a place for dog behaviorists. It's just that I'm a combination of the old and the new, or I'd like to think so, anyway. If I am the center of the dog's world, the dog will work with me as I train. If the dog is intent on being the leader, I have an issue to overcome, and it doesn't require a heavy hand, just purposeful, incremental training with all the positive reinforcement techniques that I can bring to bear.

There is no short cut to a desired outcome, only undesired ones.

I want to enjoy my dog, not negotiate with it or compete with it for the role of leader.

When all is said and done, socialization is a part of my expanding the dog's world, not starting it. I prefer to be the dog's socialization interest in the first instance. I want the dog to want to be with me on command more than any distraction.

I want my mutts to be socialized with each other. I, frankly, don't give a fig if one of my dogs ever socializes with another dog or a stranger, visitor, etc. My dog's world starts with my family. Social interaction is bounded by solid training, in my opinion.

A dog will bark. I train the command 'NO' and use it to channel behavior. 'Enough' is a softer version of 'no.' My preference is to not train 'no bark' or a variation. 'No' works for me.

I rely on a basic set of commands to serve as behavioral boundaries. I use them. The dog complies. Life is good. Takes time. Consistency and purpose yields positive results, I think. And I don't need my neighbor or random guest to help me train the dog, and that is my hubris.

 Quote: Duane Hull

 Quote: Duane Hull

IMHO, she's a tad young for a "Firm correction".

Sounds to me, JMO,that she needs some desensitization, followed by not allowing her to greet people or dogs if she does make a display, period.

Sorry, Tanya... I forgot myself. The PTS thing caused me to overreact.

Yea, I was not liking that solution either. Had that been my opinion 2 years ago, the greatest dog I ever owned would be dead right now. TRAIN train TRAIN!

Then train some more!

Sorry to have gotten so defensive, the whole reason i jined this forum was because i agree with what Ed teaches and i get critisized ALOT for useing the word 'corrections" or that i use tools other then treats and a clicker to train my dogs.

my appoligizes.
and i cannot stress enough
SHE LOVES PEOPLE! she loves meeting people and other dogs especielly children she loves to be held and cuddled by strangers when i first began leash training her she didt want to move wearing a lead and would try to chew on it i would use treats and praise with some gently tugging to get her to walk it wasnt long before she associated walks= meeting people and now when she sees me get the lead she becomes excited at the prospect of meeting people.

she doesnt lunge or try to attack she makes alot of noise when she isnt able to reach people and get petted/attention from them then she growls and barks.

No aggression from her, she LOVES people she is a typical Bull Terrier.

and like i said before, Its very rare to find a human aggressive Bull Terrier they are known for there human loving nature, they make perfect childrens dogs as they are very tolorant and loving of children, and i know that a puppy who is alpha of its litters mates does not necessarily mean its going to be dominant with humans, which she isnt, will she be tough aroundo ther dogs when she grows up, yes i think she will she tries to pester and dominant my adult male right now, so im working my bum off showing her that that is unacceptible in this house NO dog is dominant and shes learning quickly.

and i would rather not keep her away from people for good because as i stated she adores people adores meeting people and i LIKE that about her and i want to encourage her to be affectionate towards people but i dont want her thinking that all that noise is goign to get her attention from people.

yes i can stop having her meet and greet for a while while traing her BUt i dont plan on keeping her away from meeting people as theres no need to, she adores meeting people.

and as far as the become a behaviorlist, no i dont have credidentails other then my own dogs and freinds dogs and familys dogs but its somthing i LOVE more then anything its somthing i just know im good at and its somthing i wanna do for the rest of life everyday all i do is read blogs,read forums,read studies,read books about dog behavior and about training methods from tons of differant trainers, iwatch youtube videos of dogs interacting ALL THE TIME i watch my own dogs around other dogs ALL THE TIME i can sit for hours out in the woods just watching the dogs play together or sniff or walk around or do nothing, i search craigslist for ads for people rehomeing there dogs due to behavioral issues and im always replying to offer free advice in hopes that they will take it, try it and keep the dog. its a passion that i dont care if i dont ever get paid to do it i dont care if i had to work 6 other jobs just to keep lerning and observing and working with dogs.

hence the reason i wasnt worried about taking the alpha puppy from the litter, my ONLY issue with her is im not sure what angle would be best to teach her to not growl or bark to get her own way in that specific situation.

anyways, i appreciate the advice, but i have made a poor impression and will not stick around any longer thanks all

" i search craigslist for ads for people rehomeing there dogs due to behavioral issues and im always replying to offer free advice in hopes that they will take it."


Nothing you have posted has indicated that you are in any way qualified to do this. Everything makes clear that you are not. IMHO. If anything, you should direct people to experienced resources.

In the replies to you, there's probably several times the years of your entire life represented in dog-training experience. Too bad you're not paying attention.

It takes a certain level of awareness to realize how much you don't know.