Quote: Betty Waldron

Hey Sweetie!
I was hoping you would chime in.

Your thoughts are pretty much mine. And you hit on a very important point. The other dog is a sweetie but is extremely skittish, I've boarded her. I did wonder also if that could of
played into it. Out of the two she is the one someone would try and approach if they were trying to do a good deed by looking for tags and it would of terrified her.

He's safe now, that's the important thing and has a home here for as long as he needs it.

He could have been protecting her. You will probably never know. If I had the dog, I would just socialize him at every opportunity and see how he does with stress. So many things could have happened in the 2 hour period, it's impossible to say what could have triggered the bite. He may have had a crazy street crossing or a run in with an aggressive dog 2 minutes before the landscaping guy incident.


Along with Bob's line of thinking, how does he handle pressure from you? Like body blocking or taking a toy away?

How old is he?

This must be so frustrating for you Betty, a dog from your own litter that was carefully bred and prepared for his new home, being brought back because there has been an incident that couldn’t possibly have been anticipated by you.

My feeling is that the two dogs who became a self reliant pack when they found their adventure had turned into a scary situation, did what feral dogs do, the fight or flight instinct kicked in, and when they were approached by a stranger, reacted in a way I imagine a lot of dogs would – defend themselves and each other; if my lot got out of the safety of their home, I can say with utter certainty that three out of the four would respond in the same way, especially if they were spooked by being cornered or grabbed, and Kaiser especially, who even at the age of four is incredibly immature and anxious, would freak out in the situation ‘your’ dog did.

I don’t have any valid experience or qualifications to offer any advice, but I just want to say I am sorry this has happened to one of your pups, who so clearly had the best preparedness for life away from his mother and sibs, and who has been put in a situation that doesn’t accurately, or fairly, represent his true nature.

Regardless of how thoroughly a new home is vetted and evaluated prior to placing, you can’t anticipate every scenario, and it sounds like this was one of those avoidable, but distressing circumstances that have no bearing on the dog’s real temperament and stability.

Betty, is there any way to talk to the landscaper in a non-judgemental or threatening way to see if he could give you any insight into what happened? It's possible he might have seen something that would give you a clue.

Two dogs really do feed off each other.

If there were two big german shepherds making
a barking display, nervous workers acting in a "prey" manner with no owner around, no one to recall, it's easy to see how the situation could go south. It doesn't mean this is a "bad dog" in my view, it means it's a powerful dog and the future owner needs to respect his power and be on hand when the dog is loose.
People have no sense.

How old is this dog, Betty?

It's going to be hard to recreate anything as long as YOU are handling him, Betty. There was a thread here a while ago about pack leader "projection". As an accomplished trainer and breeder, you are a savvy dog person. As a result of your experiences, you carry yourself with a certain "confidence".. The confidence that you are a leader and you will not let anything happen. The dog will catch that down the leash. Since the dog is with you, he is secure in the knowledge that he will not have to protect himself.

Dogs act a lot different with people they know they are safe with and those they don't trust to protect them, just as they act differently when they are running loose.

If the dog is looking stable to you, and you aren't seeing anything that you think might trigger an aggessive incident, then it was probably just the perfect storm of circumstances that led the bite....

I fully agree that if/when you place this dog, it will need to be with a dog savvy person with strong leadership and structure in place.

Delete

Edited by Jodi Moen (11/03/2013 01:20 PM)
Edit reason: wrong thread

Good points all, thank you.

Takes pressure from me fine. I'm a firm believer in getting those little tussles over with right away on my terms and there was not a problem. No possessiveness, and I haven't even seen any territorialism with his crate. I've tested that.

I had a friend here today doing some landscaping work for me and I had him out on a long line, my friend is not comfortable around dogs and while the dog would look over once in a while to see what he was doing he really wasn't that interested.

Talking to the landscapers is not an option. I'm not the one that may be sued. Florida homeowner policy's have a tendency to roll over on these type of claims and pay to the limits of the policy with no questions asked. I've seen that happen over and over again.

He is social and has high thresholds. But he is also a big boned dark sable and even if he bounded up to you to play it would probably scare the living**** out of someone that was not use to dogs. I could see that going south very quickly and would not blame the person that was minding their own business.

He's 3 and a half and all puppy.

We'll just keep testing him, unfortunately I can't walk any of the dogs in this area but have to go to town to do that. Too may loose dogs here.

I hate to sound like one of those people that makes excuses for a dog, Kind of like a not my kid thing, but so far I'm not seeing anything but a really cool dog and one that I'm proud to of bred.

Time will tell I guess. We are in no hurry.

Are both GSDs similar looking? Is it possible that the skittish one did the biting but the assertive one took the rap?

Doubtful.

He is a substantial big boned dark sable and she is much more or a slender bi color.