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Re: Puppy Tracking
[Re: Chad Stahl ]
#3744 - 12/16/2001 08:09 PM |
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Vince, you forgot to mention the bacterial action from the disturbed soil....personally, I think it's a mixture of things. But it's not quite as important to understand that as it is to understand what kind of behavior you want the dog to perform.
Lisa & Lucy, CGC, Wilderness Airscent
Western Oregon Search Dogs |
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Re: Puppy Tracking
[Re: Chad Stahl ]
#3745 - 12/16/2001 09:56 PM |
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Come on Vince! That explanation sounded like a personal attack to me!LOL <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />
JUST KIDDING EVERYONE! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />
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Re: Puppy Tracking
[Re: Chad Stahl ]
#3746 - 12/17/2001 03:31 AM |
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I forgot to mention that I start out on hard surface when teaching tracking.
Vince, you are right that we don't understand exactly whats going on in terms of how the dog sees scent.
However, the theory behind this approach is that by tracking in an area with many other human scents and trampled grass etc.-- we essentially randomize the other scents so that the only one that leads to success is the one that the tracklayer has laid. The idea is that the dog will learn to follow a specific odor.
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Re: Puppy Tracking
[Re: Chad Stahl ]
#3747 - 12/17/2001 09:24 AM |
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Dave:
More power to you. I have one of the best trackers in the country for a TD so I follow the "I say you do" principle. Don't bother searching guys you wont find that in any books. LOL.
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Re: Puppy Tracking
[Re: Chad Stahl ]
#3748 - 12/17/2001 10:46 AM |
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Vince... I know what you mean. The trainers that "really know what they are doing" will not usually put up with anything less than 100% dedication.
I trained with a master trainer from the Tom Rose school for years and we did a modified force tracking approach that worked fairly well... but frankly, I got kind of bored because Schutzhund tracking is very basic and primarily focuses on precision.
Can I ask... what your TD's basic/general approach is? (I assume were talking about Schutzhund-type tracking).
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Re: Puppy Tracking
[Re: Chad Stahl ]
#3749 - 12/17/2001 12:40 PM |
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Dave, I have a question for you. For tracking in wilderness SAR applications, would you recommend starting in contaminated areas as well? What about surface type?
Lisa & Lucy, CGC, Wilderness Airscent
Western Oregon Search Dogs |
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Re: Puppy Tracking
[Re: Chad Stahl ]
#3750 - 12/17/2001 02:07 PM |
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J Parker... I'm not an expert in S&R. But the short answer is "yes". One common problem in S&R tracking is that, even in the wildernes, the area may often be contaminated by searchers... family members etc.
I start with hard surface and teach each new surface (grass, dirt, gravel etc.) as though we it were the first day of tracking... a few short easy ones and progress from there.
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Re: Puppy Tracking
[Re: Chad Stahl ]
#3751 - 12/17/2001 02:13 PM |
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Yes, that makes sense. One goal that our dog team has for the tracking dog is that he be able to pick up the trail and establish a direction of travel. He may have to do so from a highly contaminated area. In the past, his training program had started with no contamination, and working up to contaminated areas. What you're suggesting is the reverse, so it's a change in gears from the way I've been thinking.
When you train for transitions from one surface to another, such as grass to dirt, or dirt to paved road, etc., does that come easier since you've started the dog on hard surfaces?
This is interesting, because what you're suggesting is certainly the opposite of everything I thought I knew about tracking training, which is to start with the easy stuff and work up to the hard stuff. You're starting with the hard stuff at the beginning it seems.....
Lisa & Lucy, CGC, Wilderness Airscent
Western Oregon Search Dogs |
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Re: Puppy Tracking
[Re: Chad Stahl ]
#3752 - 12/17/2001 05:26 PM |
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Under the ususal approach--what makes cross-tracks so difficult is that we have to re-train the dog not to follow the strongest scent.
This approach doesn't view "contamination" as being more difficult because we simply teach the dog to differenttiate between the scent of "apples and oranges" almost from the beginning.
Is this approach better? It seems to yeild a more versatile tracker than my old method-- but who knows. I'm still learning with each track.
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Re: Puppy Tracking
[Re: Chad Stahl ]
#3753 - 12/17/2001 09:23 PM |
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If you don't mind my asking, how long have you been training this way, and what are the pros and cons? Do your dogs track real suspects, and if so, what kind of success rate do they have? What about aged tracks? With SAR, you're rarely going to have a track less than 12 hours old. People generally don't call out the SAR until the subject has been missing for quite some time, so aging is really important in training for SAR. I'm wondering if that would alter your approach at all?
Thanks in advance.
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