Quote: tracey holden

 Quote: Bob Scott

 Quote: Candi Campbell

 Quote: Bob Scott

It's done for the purpose of keeping the dog looking alert and ears up when doing their "flying trot" around the ring.

ASIDE:

1) "Flying Trot", my A$$ -- Those poor CRIPPLED "hyenas" in the GSD breed ring...

2) ALL it often does is distract the dog and disrupt its gait...

3) Of course it's a Rules Violation and a DAMNED DISGRACE

IMHO, just goes to prove how many Complete Crackpots are breeding show-line GSD in the USA.

I don't recall every having seen a GSD just walking around the ring.

Seems they don't want anyone seeing that disaster.

Go to you tube and look up American GSD gait in the show ring.

It isn't just in America sadly. I just don't get why the people who breed this type of deformity have a valid reason for it.

There is NO "valid" reason for it -- Might as well change the breed's name to "Quasimodo Shepherds" Defective/Deformed rear ends do not make for Good Health or Proper Movement at ANY speed, IMHO.

 Quote: Duane Hull

When the GSD does his gaited trot in the show ring, he should be pushing off of his back feet in an elongated stride. That is why they are bred for the exaggerated angulation... to elongate the stride. The angulated stride causes them to hobble when they walk, but it is not visible in the trot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s6B9UGuYK2s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1z14VIsQMfU

When the GSD trots in the show ring, the hobble is not as visible as when he is not being gaited. That is the issue that most GSD people have with showlines and show breeding.

The first video posted by Duane shows the dog in long grass, so it's not as obvious, but I have seen other slo-mo videos of a GSD doing the "flying trot" where it is clear that the hocks are actually touching the ground or very close to it.

Dogs have pads on their feet because that is the part that is supposed to come in contact with the ground. Humans and other primates evolved to walk on their hocks (heels); it is unnatural in a four-legged animal like a dog.

Or a horse, who steps on the part it is supposed to, the hoof, which evolved for the same purpose as a dog's pads. And an extended trot, with beautiful propulsion, can be achieved without the horse having to drop its hindquarters so low as to touch the ground with its hocks. I know horses and dogs are not the same animal, but I'm just sayin'......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7uuW6KfEjY

It seems to me that the directives of the UK Kennel Club are focusing a lot on double-handling and stacking. I hope there will be equal attention paid to the pathetic egg-beater hobbling movement of those overly long and angulated hind limbs in the breed that is seen when the dog moves at anything slower than the extended trot. It's a sad and demeaning thing to see in what is otherwise a beautiful, noble breed of dog.

I hope that my post did not come across as validation or justification for breeding for angulation in GSD show lines. It was intended for informative purposes only.

I do not advocate the breed standards that allow for this exploitation of the GSDs genetics.

 Quote: Duane Hull

I hope that my post did not come across as validation or justification for breeding for angulation in GSD show lines. It was intended for informative purposes only.

I do not advocate the breed standards that allow for this exploitation of the GSDs genetics.

I didn't take it that way, Duane, and my apologies to you if you thought I did. I only quoted you because I thought the videos you included were appropriately demonstrative to what I wanted to mention in my own post.

I guess the main point I was trying to make is that it is not necessary to have that kind of excessive angulation and conformational deformity to get a nice-looking gait. Promoting extreme exaggeration of any feature in a purebred dog is usually not in the best interest of the animals, as is being proven time and time again in many breeds, not just the GSD.

I think we're more or less in agreement! Just goes to show that, sometimes, conversations using only the written word on an Internet forum can be confusing, to say the least!

 Quote: Duane Hull

I hope that my post did not come across as validation or justification for breeding for angulation in GSD show lines. It was intended for informative purposes only.

I do not advocate the breed standards that allow for this exploitation of the GSDs genetics.

Understood, Duane, no prob -- Knew you were NOT in favor of it...

I began in Basenjis about 50 Years ago -- They are a primitive dog that hasn't been wrecked yet by HARMFUL breeding for PERVERTED conformation:

Basenjis' natural gait-of-choice, when NOT coursing game at the gallop, is a "double suspension" trot like that of Standardbred racing Trotters (horses) where all four feet are off the ground at the same time TWICE in each stride-cycle...

Their breed standard calls for Level Backs & Moderate Angulation with Pasterns neither "sloping" nor "upright" and Long Second Thighs with Hocks Well Let-Down & Perpendicular to the Ground...

Of course correct GSD conformation is different than the Basenji, but I mention it simply to show that an "extended or flying" trot is neither produced nor perfected by breeding for outlandish crippling of GSD backs & hindquarters

The "modern" GSD's gait was developed in the 70s based on one or two big winning dogs.

From the 60's back it wasn't all that uncommon for GSDs to be shown in the breed AND Schutzhund trials.

don't count the working titles in many of the German Show lines. They are, for the most part a joke!

Why all of a sudden in the 70s did the show folks decide that they could improve on the dogs movement?????

I've seen it happen to many other breeds also.

Many modern day terriers are way to big for earth work simply because it's easier to breed a "correct" larger dog then a "correct" smaller dog of the same breed.

In the 80s when the Australian Shepherds and the Border Collies were being campaigned for AKC breed acceptance we started seeing larger dogs, fuller coats, less working ability.

The same happened to the JRT when the show folks got hold of it.

The JRTCA requires individual dogs to be registered, NOT whole litters and then they have to pass tests as to genetic faults, etc.

The AKC eliminated the two different sizes of JRTs, restricted what sort of coat they could have, yadda, yadda!

On top of that they actually changed the name after being sued by and beat by the JRTCA over the name.

The AKC JRT is now the Parson Russell Terrier.

The JRTCA still holds working shows where the dog can earn a coveted cert called the Bronze Medallion.

This award can only be won by a dog that has correctly worked in a natural earth to 3 different quarries AND is witnessed by a registered JRTCA working judge.

I could go on and on abut different breeds and how the AKC has changed them for nothing more then making a "pretty" breed and making little to no effort in keeping the breeds original character.

In other words, cookie cutter dogs!

 Quote: Bob Scott

The "modern" GSD's gait was developed in the 70s based on one or two big winning dogs.

From the 60's back it wasn't all that uncommon for GSDs to be shown in the breed AND Schutzhund trials.

don't count the working titles in many of the German Show lines. They are, for the most part a joke!

Why all of a sudden in the 70s did the show folks decide that they could improve on the dogs movement?????

I've seen it happen to many other breeds also.

Many modern day terriers are way to big for earth work simply because it's easier to breed a "correct" larger dog then a "correct" smaller dog of the same breed.

In the 80s when the Australian Shepherds and the Border Collies were being campaigned for AKC breed acceptance we started seeing larger dogs, fuller coats, less working ability.

The same happened to the JRT when the show folks got hold of it.

The JRTCA requires individual dogs to be registered, NOT whole litters and then they have to pass tests as to genetic faults, etc.

The AKC eliminated the two different sizes of JRTs, restricted what sort of coat they could have, yadda, yadda!

On top of that they actually changed the name after being sued by and beat by the JRTCA over the name.

The AKC JRT is now the Parson Russell Terrier.

The JRTCA still holds working shows where the dog can earn a coveted cert called the Bronze Medallion.

This award can only be won by a dog that has correctly worked in a natural earth to 3 different quarries AND is witnessed by a registered JRTCA working judge.

I could go on and on abut different breeds and how the AKC has changed them for nothing more then making a "pretty" breed and making little to no effort in keeping the breeds original character.

In other words, cookie cutter dogs!

YES, all too common in many breeds, to the RUINATION of most that have been "improved" by IDIOTS...

Ironically & Absurdly, there is nothing at all "pretty" about those poor CRIPPLED "hyenas" being shown in the GSD breed ring as a result of Brain-Dead Breeding MALPRACTICE

I think we reached a similar conclusion in the Joel Smith "Breeding for Health" post! The original purpose of a breed is much of the reason for its appearance, but when the breed is recognized by a registering body, the looks of the breed seem to get the most attention.
Imagine a club show where a breed's personality was tested....could you imagine the Toy Group judging? How long will they sit on your lap and keep you warm!?
No offense to anyone with warm cuddly lap dogs!

 Quote: Christina Lockard

I think we reached a similar conclusion in the Joel Smith "Breeding for Health" post! The original purpose of a breed is much of the reason for its appearance, but when the breed is recognized by a registering body, the looks of the breed seem to get the most attention.

Imagine a club show where a breed's personality was tested....could you imagine the Toy Group judging? How long will they sit on your lap and keep you warm!?

No offense to anyone with warm cuddly lap dogs!

Apparently, most Dobermans must think THEY are in the Toy Group, by THAT criterion, LOL.

Imagine a JRT that weights 60lbs.

OH...wait! I think they call that a Mal.