Any information I would have would be purely anecdotal, however I tend not to agree with that article and would like to see a peer review of it. I know when I worked for Southwest Research Institute, we did a considerable amount of olfactory sensitivity testing. Our research was not directed towards determining olfaction capabilities among various breeds, however certain breeds did work better for us. I still would be very much interested in the article however should you track it down.

Thanks

DFrost

I'll work on that. If you guys get me your e-mails I can try to get it to you. I have to get home to find it.

I think some dog have a harder time smelling than others. My dal has worked cadaver, but is not very good at it. If cadaver or articles are above ground or an inch or two underground he finds with no problem (he loves to make a find alive or not). Buried 6 inches underground he will not alert so I know he does not smell it because he will do anything for his reward. My GSD has worked cadaver once and had no trouble finding buried aged cadaver. The dal has a much shorter snout and I beleive he can not smell as good as my GSD. Drives and love of work are all there in the dal (very high).

Thanks guys! I was offline for a few days. Ed your idea of a dog downing to indicate an item can taint evidence hits home with me. I have had my dog actually lie on top of the evidence item. Funny how when you work a dog a certain way long enough you don't think of the obvious! I was under the impression you thought a dog may get off track or lose intrest by downing, but your clarification makes good sense. Thanks ( i feel loved again LOL)

Back to the topic....

I've read from the previous posts ways not to have a dog indicate and reasons why. Down-destroy evidence. Aggressive-destroy evidence. Sit- I have a PE(patrol/explosive dog), so that's not happenin'. What are the alternatives? Please be specific. Mr. Frawley said bring your dog off the track to down him. Well what did the dog do(response) to tell you to bring him off track. Thanks.

David

When we trained mine, tunnel, tripwire dogs, or explosives detectors, a passive response was used for the obvious reasons. Disturbing that target could be the last thing you do. The same with a patrol/explosives detector. If you are going to train it to give a response to discarded evidence, you still have the same worry as before. Do you trust your dog to give a different response to anything other than a possible IED??? I would hope not. While it is certainly possible to train a dog to do many different things, why take the chance. If the dog is trained to "sit" on explosives, procedure calls for EOD Techs to render safe. What do you do in the field, on a track, and the dog indicates on say a back pack as discarded evidence. I guess i'm just a purist. I hate mixing too many responses, particularly on an explosives detector. The benefits just don't seem to justify the possible disaster that could ensue. Just my thoughts.

DFrost

Ummh! I would not want any of my k9's disturbing evidence. Mr. Frawley and Frost, IMHO, are correct. Evidence can be destroyed and evidence techs here in Ma. prefer a piece of evidence as pristine as possible as do our courts. It is also in certain circumstances safer for the handler. 30 yrs ago agressive indication was the norm and preferred. It was required by some certification organizations With todays climate re: bad guys many can easily set a trap tripped by disturbance for LEO's. This includes airbags in cars as well as others far more terroristic. I could not imagine our dogs in Nam agressively pawing a VC corpse or trip wire, well, maybe only once. TOI studies at various Institutes have determined that certain animals with specific vaso nasal traits have various scent sensitivity thresholds. This applies to humans as well. To say that one breed is better than another based on scent cell count alone would be ludicrous. We all know it is not the size of the dog in the fight but---. Using physical and mental traits to the fullest is also an important variable. Some of you all use various terms like drive etc. This is IMHO as an outsider. Always be worthy of your dog. Dr.L.

30 years ago,(as far as the military was concerned) the norm was to train drug dogs with an aggressive response, explosives detectors with a passive response. Mine, tunnel, booby trap dogs etc, were also trained with a passive response. The concern for the passive response on Explosives detectors was so great that all explosives dogs trained for the military and the Federal Aviation Administration were given negative tests on drug odors. A response on a drug odor, passive or aggressive meant immediate decertification and removal. Extinction training was not even considered.

DFrost

Originally posted by DFrost:
30 years ago,(as far as the military was concerned) the norm was to train drug dogs with an aggressive response, explosives detectors with a passive response. Mine, tunnel, booby trap dogs etc, were also trained with a passive response. The concern for the passive response on Explosives detectors was so great that all explosives dogs trained for the military and the Federal Aviation Administration were given negative tests on drug odors. A response on a drug odor, passive or aggressive meant immediate decertification and removal. Extinction training was not even considered.

DFrost Why would a dog alert on drugs if it was trained for explosives. This is not a dog issue, but a training issue. I would suspect that the dog is alerting to the packaging or the person that hides the substance. I am not aware that training a dog for explosives would also cross-train some dogs for drugs. This is not possiable to my knowledge.

Absolutly. I will never engage in bashing but I am sure you know the LEO-K9( org. ) I referred too in the early 70's. regarding evidence recovery including firearms, made safe or not. The term recovery is self explanatory. We all had different perspectives back then and needs. Some jurisdictions needed some guide lines to establish a unit. We old timers all went through this I imagine. It is true that military training was passive re: explosives. I would not be here if they had not trained that way. For my little brain, passive has worked for me since the early 80's for narcs, body, firearms etc. B2B and always be worthy of your dog!!