I have heard many SAR and even LEO trainers talk about building drive. I for one think you can only build upon what is given. You can't create hunt drive, it's in the dog or not.

I'm wondering though, if this is a matter of semantics in many instances?
I think a dog can have the ability and drive for the work and yet through poor training practices, become a very poor worker. The same dog, through good training practices can be a happy and enthusiastic worker. I think that may be what a lot of people mean when saying the words build drive, increasing drive etc. Now, if they were to say create drive, then I'd say Hold on a minute!. But what I'm thinking is that perhaps they just mean the idea of applying proper motivation to increase the dog's enthusiasm?

J Parker writes:I think a dog can have the ability and drive for the work and yet through poor training practices, become a very poor worker. The same dog, through good training practices can be a happy and enthusiastic worker.
JL writes: Yes, very true. I was speaking more to the idea that you can make, or build something into a dog they don't have. You can make it "look" like the dog is working, yet they may just be performing a behavior to avoid a correction, or to get some kind of reward, even self reward. It's like a dog who has been compulsed into a deep nose track. They might never bring their head up, but it doesn't mean they are tracking. Or they learn to take you for a nature walk on a track as the reward(self) of roaming the woods replaces the hunt for the specific scent. And just to steal from those I know... "you can go back to a place you've never been"..and my fav of all, dear Uncle Lou..."you can't make chicken salad out of chicken s#@t."

Josh:

I’m a little confused. If I have a dog that will hunt all day for his prey object or the promise of his prey object at the end of the hunt is this dog truly working or is this an example of what you call “look like the dog is working.”

Josh, I gotcha.....and yes, I know all about those darn nature walks! LOL! But I think even that behavior can boil down to training, not neccessarily drive. I'm not denying the importance of drive, or the necessity for it, but I think that it's easy to look at a poorly trained dog and call it "lack of drive", because it's less painful than admitting one's own failures as a trainer. I know this one first hand! Fortunately, it's not a matter of going back to where I've never been....I've BEEN there, it's just a matter of fixing training errors and being more patient and not trying to advance more quickly than I should.

Vince, I believe it's a matter of being able to read your dog. Do you know when the dog is on scent vs. when the dog is goofing off? It can be really hard to tell, but with experience, it becomes easier.

JP writes: but I think that it's easy to look at a poorly trained dog and call it "lack of drive", because it's less painful than admitting one's own failures as a trainer.
JL answers: Perhaps, but it is not exactly what I was speaking about. I guess it is our "fooling" ourselves in believing a dog is doing something correct, or "in drive" when they are going through the motions physically performing the task for fear of correction and not from drive. Example; there is a "famous" e-collar "trainer" who stims his dog out to a bite. The dog goes out and bites the sleeve. Is this real protection? Is this a dog I want to put out on the street with one of my handlers?..hmmmm the dog did perform the act required... The dog has poor training, and must have some ability to bite even if it is strictly in prey or it would not perform at all. I am saying that just because it looks right doesn't mean it is right. Again a dog who keeps his nose deep into a "track" for fear of correction for bringing their head up might not even be tracking at all. Unless you laid the track, you have no idea what the dog is following. It looks right as the dog is keeping it's nose down and taking you somewhere. The "looks like" and ability sometimes get blurred in training. The problem with this in SAR or LEO work is real people count on the results. Hope that made my point a bit more clear.

I guess my overbearing, work originated paranioa came out int the last one....I always think in the sense of finding someone to take them on custody, not in the sense of finding someone because they are lost. I have to remember not everone is a bad guy........another lesson learned. Where is a good place to get started in SAR? I always considered it, but never took the plunge. Here in Navajo County, we have lots of caves, caverns and canyons. lots of non-residents are getting lost for days on end. Maybe a dog would help. Thanks for the insight.

trooper, if you want on getting started in a SAR email me at peppcso@msn.com

Josh, point taken. Thanks for taking the time to make that clear.

mrpumba If you have further questions on SAR check out S&R - Tracking Through Drive. Topic closed.