DFrost:
I noticed some of the gsd's on that show (or at least they looked like gsds...) having docked tails. Is/was this a military requirement or just an issue of a dog having had a tail injury?
(There were also some gsd's that had not been docked...)

I saw only one GSD with a docked tail, there seem to be a mostly GSD and Malinois, maybe a couple of Dutch Shepards (gray looking dog) and I think I saw a all black Malinois doing the bomb search of the outdoor podium. That was a nice looking Mal. Could have been a black GSD and they always look sharp. There was one old Lab that was ten years old, that was training a handler.

I think the key idea to look at is that the dogs were actually training the handlers, instead of learning together. Most of those handler would never have made it the if they had to train a dog from scracht. Even with an instructor present.

Overall I enjoyed the short take on Military dog training and learned that a different view on dog training, that seems to work. I was amazed at how the dogs, seem to not show heat stroke signs before it was nearly too late. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I watched the show also, was interesting and entaining, have enjoyed reading the responses here on the board. What about that litter of 15 tho? if I heard right they will foster them out for a year then begin to train/work with them.

I guess I'm the only one who was kinda mortified by the program. The poor quality of the training, the low standard for performance, the two dogs in extreme heat distress in a 4 week period (and yes, dogs DO show outward signs of distress before they reach 109.8 degrees! I've got one who overheats easily and it's recognizable LONG before then!). To be honest, found it kinda scary to think people with this level of experience and knowledge are out there handling a dog on their own and someone is depending on them.

Well, they used to send the dogs to blow up tanks and dig up mines. At least these dogs got to outlive their training. The story of the heat-striken first dog was not clear. The handler was clearly inexperienced and did not catch the signs of distress. The second dog was an invalid.

In regards to docked tails. These dogs are very often rejects of sports programs in Europe. Usually on conformation - bite, balls, ears, color. Czech Republic in particular. That's why many of the GSD's ears were not standing right. There was also a dog with very funny floppy ears. Same deal with the tail, some sort of an accident that barred it from being worked in sport. I remember a Mal with a docked tail too. Sure you can participate with a non-conforming dog, but you'd like to have a good dog that you can actually breed.

They said that they reject a lot of dogs that are being brought over from Europe. I wonder what happens to them. Soap factory?

The old dogs in the second hour were the veteran scent detecting dogs. They actually did more to instruct the handlers than, probably the instructors.

What I and others noticed was the fact that when they would release the sleeve, the dog would continue on the sleeve. I hope that's not how they finish the real patrol dog's training.

Hello All:

While stationed at Camp Pendleton in the early 19080's, all dogs were docked regardless of breed. Mostly, because these dogs are kennelled unless they are working (they don't go home with the handlers) and they had problems with dogs hitting their tails on the bars in the kennels. I don't know if this was done at every duty station, but I know it was done where I was.

Hope this helps,
Brandon

Sorry Folks:

I met 1980's (can't type while trying to eat)

Later
Brandon

The 23 years I was in the MWD Program, the military did not make it a standard practice to dock tails. Some were docked by Breeders as markers for dogs that were not show and or breed quality dogs. Others for injuries to the tail, it was easier to dock them that try to heal them. Heat stress in Texas, is like getting wet in Oregon state I reckon. It's the nature of the beast. If the student didn't pick up the signs of the dog in distress the instructor should have. However, you would be surprised how much of that a dog can take, once acclimated. In my 13 years as an Instructor at the dog school, I could count on one hand the number of dogs that died because of heat exhaustion or stroke. The military trains for what they do. And for what they need, they train a pretty good dog. While there was some research done on using dogs to deliver explosives, there never was an organized program to train them to do that. there were mine, tunnel, trip wire dogs quite a few of them were killed or injured but they were trained to detect, not detonate the mines and trip wire booby traps. The military has been in the dog business many years. they have done a lot of things with dogs, that law enforcement in general would never need. The FAA certified explosives detector dogs, which were initially all trained by active duty Air Force are as good as any you will find in the US. The Dog School at Lackland is also where the Secret Service Explosives detector dog program got it's start, as well as the US Customs Drug dog program. The first managers and trainers for both those programs were retired AF Instructors. There is a lot of history with the Military working dogs. Some of it is interesting.

DFrost

I never meant the US mil. dogs. Eastern Front. A dog for 3-4 people and a tank. It's a great deal.

DC Frost : Thank you so much for you post ,very well said . This was a program of the insight of the K-9 Boot Camp . Theses are not SCH dogs and the handlers are new .It would be good to have tape of me the first day on the sch field , or doing obedience i for one look nothing like i did when i first came out ,20 something years ago ,so we need to look at it for what it was ,just an insight .I think most dog handlers in the military that have a high profile jobs ,are more mature, and, more experienced,and there dogs are thinner. IMHO Peter