Nope, no American bloodlines. Though I still disagree, Rottweilers can do well in the AKC show
ring and on the schutzhund field. My dog's sire was IPO3, multi Sieger, and had placements in
the Group ring in AKC (Flordia circuit).

My dog's pedigree...
Sire was Umbro van het Polderbos, a Matcho v Burgthann son out of Raika
vom schloss Hexental. Matcho was an Irk son and Raika was out of Muck v Gruntenblick and
Anka vh Boya Park (sister to Arko vh Boya Park, french working dog) Raika also produced two
other nice males, Tron and Tyson van het Polderbos who were both miltiple champions and
IPO3. Tyson is actually Belgiums highest SchH scoring rottweiler ever.

His dam is Ushi van Bangais, a Henry vom Scheldetal daughter. Henry was out of Astor
vd Mainspitz. Her dam was Senta vd Franceska Hoeve, a Jaro vd Contente daughter out of
Prinscess van de Beja Hoeve. Jaro is a Hassan v Konigsgarten son and Princess is a daughter of Scott vt Straotje.

Yes I've heard of the ZTP, BST, etc. Its not that I don't know what they are, its just my first time doing all this. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Your example is the exception in the AKC, so I don't really see how you can disagree.

Lightining strikes sometimes. . .

Rottie-Fancier,
I understand what your trying to do but if you go to a German-style show the judge will give you a critque on your dog he will not pull no punches with you he will tell you all the faults with your dog and how well your dog meets the standard.This will give you an honest evaluation how well your dog meets the breed standard.This is only one part to see if your male is breed suitiable. :rolleyes:

Rottie-Man, the next German-Style show is in November I think and it is 6 hours away, and the next one after that is in March and that is 4-5 hours away (if they decide to hold it this year, last year they opted just to do a Protection Tournament). I'm going to try and attend the one in November since I really do want to get him critiqued.

Working abiltiy, working ability, working ability....basically I do not know what I'm doing even though the dog could be a very good candidate for working. At 10 months we went to a seminar with Joy Tiz (member of this board) and they all said he was good in that respect. They were German Shepherd people though, so I don't really think they knew what to do with the Rottweiler <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> We didn't do anything with the sleeve, just a lot of prey work. I'm currently awaiting word from his co-owner who may possibly title him for me because the co-owner is experienced in the sport and has access to training grounds, a schutzhund club, and trials.

Now, does a CGC count as a working title by any chance <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Can a Pomeranian get one? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

R-F, I dont know how much you know about Sch. training that is only one aspect of the training,one of the most important things is that your male is mentally ready for the sport.Also learn all that you can about the training because you need an experienced helper to train your boy. Just because they have a club doesnt mean they have good trainers! I would recemend that you go and see for yourself and come back here and ask lots of questions on what you seen. There is many people on this site that will help you. Alas, no a canine good citizen doesnt go towards a working title. Good luck & Good Training! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I believe that everyone, with every breed should lose a little interest in what their dogs look like. If you breed a dog to have long legs, this does not mean that the dog will be able to run fast. If you breed dogs to run fast, you will end up with fast dogs. For instance, take a look at Mr. Frawley's dogs, I don't think they would be the best show dogs in the world. They do not have the sloping backs or flat feet that is so important to AKC. They do, however, have the inherited ability to be superior working dogs. I do not have any experience in breeding rotts. I do have enough experience breeding dogs to know that if you want to breed dogs that will succeed in competition, you have to breed them to compete and forget about what they look like. Don't get me wrong, I love a good looking dog. Usually, a good looking dog means a healthy dog, when they are bred to be healthy. When selecting a dog as a candidate for my breeding program, I only concern myself with how they perform the task(s) they were bred to do. Sometimes, there are expamples of dogs that can do things very well but are unable to pass these traits on to their offspring. You must remember that just because a dog performs well, does not mean he/she will be a reproducer. Everyone that decides to take on the responsibility of breeding dogs should remember these facts. We have a lot of very screwed up breeds in this country as a result of breeders who breed their dogs because, "The judges say my dog is very pretty..." What we are left with now are empty shells of great performing dogs. Rotts are a perfect example of this. Many people think that a big dog is a dangerous dog. So, they bred their dogs to be bigger and bigger. I have seen rotts that are pushing 200lbs. Now we have thousands of huge, worthless(and sometimes dangerous) rotts in every other back yard. Do yourself, your dogs, and everyone else a favor and take a good look at your dog. Is he exceptional at the things he was designed to do? Is he easy to train for the things you want him to do? Is he very healthy(naturally)? If your answers are all yes, try breeding him to an equal caliber female. If the puppies turn out to be as or more outstanding than the parents were, I would say that you may have a possible stud dog. After a few litters you will be able to see if this is something that he can repeat. This is how you build a reputation as being a good breeder. I wish you luck and I hope your rott is everything you want him to be.

 Quote:

Originally posted by VanCamp:
Your example is the exception in the AKC, so I don't really see how you can disagree.

Lightining strikes sometimes. . .

Lightening seems to be rampent here....

AKC CH Jeneck's Sam SchIII, IPOIII, AD, FH, ABST (Freiberg) Koerung (Mehlin)
AKC CH Santo Vom Schwaiger Wappen SCH3 Gekort
AKC CH Benno VD Schwarzen Heide SCH3
AKC CH Endo vd Teufelsbruck SchH1, ZTP
Am/Can CH BISS/BIS Winner Champ Vilstaler Land, IPO1
AKC & VDH CH Neck v Hause Anin, SchH3
BIS/BISS CH. Othello Vom Hause Neubrand, ZtP, SchH III, IPO III, FH, AD
AM Ch, Multi V Arras vom SchLoss Stutensee, Sch3, IPO3, FH, CDX, TD, TT, Gek Bis Eza
AKC/ARV CH Moritz V Moritberg, SCH3 DPO2 AD BH ZTP (over 30 times V1)
17 times V1 AKC pointed, Eldo Vom Hirschenrangen SCH3 AD BH ZTP Korung
Int'l Ch, Can Ch Aiko vom Sinnbrunnen SchHIII, FH, AD
Ch Mirko Vom Steinkopf, CDX, SCH3, FH, IPO3

Maybe your point was Rottweilers of AKC show lines are not able to cross over and do the work, but Rottweilers of working lines have proven that they can be successful show dogs as well. These are just examples of schutzhund titled dogs that were able to cross over and get their AKC or Canadian Championships. I could list more Rottweilers that were International Champions that are Schutzhund titled, or V-rated and Schutzhund titled. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Anyhow, getting past the show vs working ..... any comments on stud dog contracts, approval of the bitch, etc? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Rot-fancier
I'm impressed. I'd say go for the gold. Are any of these dogs recent? Keep the working lines strong.

Originally posted by oldearthdog:
Are any of these dogs recent? Jenecks Sam is still competing, on the IFR team I believe (American Bred dog, owner-trained and handled). Champ vom Vilstaler Land was fairly recent I believe, Othello vom Hause Neubrand I believe passed away at a young age. Mortiz vom Mortizberg is pretty recent (last 10 years)..there are a lot of nice Mortiz puppies around. All the other dogs can be found within the last 2-3 generations of a pedigree. There is a dog now competing in the AKC Shows where I live who is Schutzhund 2 and I think he's AKC pointed, I'm not sure. My first example of the IPO3, Group Placer was Umbro van het Polderbos who made the feat either last year or the beginning of this year.