I got it right! However, it's a little misleading as they always pick the small APBT rather than the more common "built" ones.

(That site could use a better rhodesian photo!)

They want to ban pit bulll dog now. What is next German Shepherd or Rottweiler.It is not the dog that is the problem it is the owner of the dogs. A pit bull dog is what you make of him just like other dogs.So many people read the new paper and that all the know. You need to be around some good pit bull dog. They are some very nice dog out there.We need to help find good homes for the dogs that have been baned.

RANDY
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------kEEP WORKING YOUR DOGS AS LONG AS YOU CAN!

QUOTE from Anne: I got it right! However, it's a little misleading as they always pick the small APBT rather than the more common "built" ones END

Good job! Yes, I see what you mean about the build, but it was the head and face (I think) that led the people I asked to choose numbers 3 and 7 and so on.

Dangit... after the 10th wrong guess I just started goin thru em in order till I found the pit.... it was kinda misleading tho, I was lookin for the built cropped ears pic.... but, I guess if I were to own a pit in Denver... I'd want it to be that one that turned out to be a pit cuz I woulda never guessed it was a pit LOL.

Connie,
When comparing to working bulldogs and working terriers look for
1) Height of top line and chest as related to the stance
2) Width of shoulders and hips in porportion to the spacing of the feet
3) Carriage of tail is distinctive
4) The porportion of width of head to width of shoulders is surprisingly constant.
5) Check out the expressiveness of the face and ears. it is usually a dead giveaway.

This site http://www.topdogbully.com has APBT's AB's and Colorado's that you can compare conformation on. I've met a handful of these dogs - they are exceptional.

QUOTE from Anne:  Connie,
When comparing to working bulldogs and working terriers look for
1) Height of top line and chest as related to the stance
2) Width of shoulders and hips in porportion to the spacing of the feet
3) Carriage of tail is distinctive
4) The porportion of width of head to width of shoulders is surprisingly constant.
5) Check out the expressiveness of the face and ears. it is usually a dead giveaway.
This site http://www.topdogbully.com has APBT's AB's and Colorado's that you can compare conformation on. I've met a handful of these dogs - they are exceptional. END QUOTE

This is exceptional info. THANKS! I clicked on all the photo links on the site page. I see now what you meant about the APBT conformation vs. the pictures on the posters. This site confirmed for me that many people's mind-picture of an APBT might be quite different from these dogs.

QUOTE from Mike: Dangit... after the 10th wrong guess I just started goin thru em in order till I found the pit END QUOTE

And doesn't that ever reinforce the basic flaw in the ban-type BSL ?! Whether those groups of pictures are perfect, flawed, in line with breed standards or not -- that all seems so irrelevant to the core issue. What seems relevant to me is that those sites can present a couple dozen photos of different breeds and confuse almost everyone who looks at them..........yet, as the newspaper article you pasted in your message that opened this thread said: "Denver's ban applies to any dog that looks like a pit bull. The animal's actual behavior does not matter."

I remember a recent thread discussing registering as opposed to outright banning, with the high registration fee going toward the admin of such a law. I can see that the difficulty of ID-ing the breed (let alone MIXES!) would be a factor in that kind of legislation, too............but at least (it seems to me) all the many errors sure to occur would result in expense to the owners instead of seizure of what might be a longtime member of the family. And the registration process (it seems to me) would go a long way toward weeding out the dog-fight people and also the animals with a rap sheet or with obvious aggression issues (whether trained or inherent).

Does that make sense, or am I missing a big piece here?

QUOTE from Mike: Dangit... after the 10th wrong guess I just started goin thru em in order till I found the pit END QUOTE

And doesn't that ever reinforce the basic flaw in the ban-type BSL ?!

Whether those groups of pictures are perfect, flawed, in line with breed standards or not -- that all seems so irrelevant to the core issue. What seems relevant to me is that those sites can present a couple dozen photos of different breeds and confuse almost everyone who looks at them..........yet, as the newspaper article you (Mike) pasted in your message that opened this thread said: "Denver's ban applies to any dog that looks like a pit bull. The animal's actual behavior does not matter."

I remember a recent thread discussing registering as opposed to outright banning, with the high registration fee going toward the admin of such a law. I can see that the difficulty of ID-ing the breed (let alone MIXES!) would be a factor in that kind of legislation, too............but at least (it seems to me) all the many errors sure to occur would result in expense to the owners instead of seizure of what might be a longtime member of the family. And the registration process (it seems to me) would go a long way toward weeding out the dog-fight people and also the animals with a rap sheet or with obvious aggression issues (whether trained or inherent).

Does that make sense, or am I missing a big piece here?

(I corrected this message to indicate that it was Mike and not Anne who posted the newspaper article.)

Bare with me a moment, I'm gonna stray from dog-talk for just a moment... I don't know if anyone is familiar with Florida's street racing laws. A while back a judge's son was killed in a car accident, it was speculated that it was because the kid was street racing and lost control or something to that effect. Because the "right" (or "wrong"?) person's son was killed - Florida's laws changed, now, if you are speeding over the Miami Turnpike all on your own at 2am (not exactly uncommon), or any highway for that matter, and you happen to own a sports car, the officer can impound your car and arrest you for street racing because it could be interpreted as "a test of speed". Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's what I understood from the recent law changes.

I am not a street racer, but I, as probably most (if not all) of you, do speed. When I drove a Red 88 Camaro, I got pulled over *constantly*, even if I wasn't speeding n a pickup got radar'd, I'd get pulled over and given a ticket for the speed the truck was going because I had a red sports car that was easy to target. I haven't had a ticket since I sold that car *knock on wood*.

Now getting onto my point: I was singled out because other people are irresponsible and reckless. I've spent close to $8,000 on court fees fighting unfair tickets, attorneys, aggressive driving classes (in exchange for no points on my license), and most of my fines were DOUBLED because the judge decided to make me pay double and take an 8 hour class to avoid my insurance rates going up. I've wasted more than 60 hours of my life dealing with classes, standing in line at the courthouse, waiting at the DMV, etc etc etc.

My point? The actions of the majority can totally screw up someones life who doesn't deserve it. Ripping everyones pitbull or "dog that looks like a pit" out of their home because the wrong persons kid got attacked is introducing huge amounts of stress into many innocent peoples lives, wasting alot of peoples time and totally screwing people up mentally by taking away what might as well be a child to many people.

Perhaps they shouldn't have bought that pit because they should have known that their city would bring back a law. Perhaps 90% of the Pit's in Denver are evil and are going to attack someone or participate in a dog fight (90%? I don't think so, I gotta believe more than 10% of the pit owning population of denver cares about their pit).

Bottom line - there's less harsh ways to introduce a law like this into a city, phasing out a breed is alot less harsh than ripping them out of peoples arms unless they leave town forever, and I personally would more than likely go to jail for the way I'd react to someone taking my GSD away from me for no reason.

I'm not for or against BSL - it seems to work for alot of places - I just disagree with it's introduction - or re-introduction as the case may be.

Flag on the play.

 Quote:

I'm not for or against BSL - it seems to work for alot of places - I just disagree with it's introduction - or re-introduction as the case may be.

I don't get it. Seems that if you are against the introduction of BSL, you'd be against it for a reason. I may have missed your point, but this one left me scratching my head.

 Quote:

Bottom line - there's less harsh ways to introduce a law like this into a city, phasing out a breed is alot less harsh than ripping them out of peoples arms unless they leave town forever, and I personally would more than likely go to jail for the way I'd react to someone taking my GSD away from me for no reason.

The "gradfather clause" has been used in many ways over the years to get people to sit still for the evaporation of property rights. After all, it's easier to talk someone into giving something away if they don't have to do it right now...

Classic example for me was the ordinance that left my grandparents' farm as one of the last few permitted to have horses in that township. Over time, it imposes other restrictions which are less and less acceptable, and more prone to arbitrary abuse.

That's my big-bad-government rant of the day.