Connie Sutherland wrote 11/14/2006 11:34 PM Re: AFS meat eater diet? [Re: alice oliver ] #117884 - 11/14/2006 11:34 PM
Connie Sutherland Moderator Reg: 07-13-2005 Posts: 31571 Loc: North-Central coast of California Offline	Quote:  Quote: the age of the meat isn't nearly as compelling as the possibility of diseased meat. if meat has spoiled, whether from age or contamination with feces, for example, it can make your dog very sick. i looked into AFS several years ago when i first started feeding raw, and passed on them back then. my breeder was adamantly against feeding AFS and when i looked into it, what i found backed her up. the whole idea of feeding a raw diet is to feed the dog healthy food. food that did not pass USDA inspection is not healthy food. just because it came from an inspected facility doesn't mean that condemned meat doesn't happen there. I would not feed anything lower than human-grade meat, period. But diseased meat is even worse in my own mind than old meat. <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif" alt="" /> I am thinking especially of disease that is passed on in brain and spinal tissue (like mad cow), but my imagination isn't limited to that. <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ooo.gif" alt="" /> My comment was triggered by the observation that they also use by-products.
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Rich Pallechio wrote 11/14/2006 11:43 PM Re: AFS meat eater diet? [Re: Angelique Cadogan ] #117885 - 11/14/2006 11:43 PM
Rich Pallechio Webboard User Reg: 05-08-2006 Posts: 687 Loc: Washington Offline	Quote: Richard , Did you add anything to the patties, like salmon oil or any extra veggies. Angelique, We mixed the AFS meat with canidae. The breeder we bought our dog from mixes the meat with Natural Choice. We switched to Cannidae because of recommendations on this board. When we couldn't get the AFS, we switched to Common Sense, http://www.commonsensedogfood.com/index.html. It has salmon oil and some veggies in it. However, my wife and son don't like handling it. It comes in rolls, not patties, and they object to the smell, though it doesn't bother me and seems to be a plus as far as my dog is concerned. But given how my wife and son feel about it ... so I've ordered Honest Kitchen to try that out. My thought was to replace the cannidae with the honest kitchen, but we might end up replacing the meat with it instead. I'm happy to discuss what I feed or don't feed my dog, but I really don't want to get into a food fight on this forum.
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Angelique Cadogan wrote 11/14/2006 11:55 PM Re: AFS meat eater diet? [Re: Rich Pallechio ] #117886 - 11/14/2006 11:55 PM
Angelique Cadogan Webboard User Reg: 10-18-2006 Posts: 1725 Loc: Las Vegas Nevada Offline	Thanks Rich, I can see that food discussion can be tough to discuss on this forum sometimes but it's all good.....I have to say that some people are very knowledgeable, and that is a plus on this forum.I can't research like some others do, they are very cleaver.But I will check out your info.I ahve always heard of honest kitchen but never looked it up .I will now. Thanks again
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Connie Sutherland wrote 11/14/2006 11:57 PM Re: AFS meat eater diet? [Re: Rich Pallechio ] #117887 - 11/14/2006 11:57 PM
Connie Sutherland Moderator Reg: 07-13-2005 Posts: 31571 Loc: North-Central coast of California Offline	Quote: ......I'm happy to discuss what I feed or don't feed my dog, but I really don't want to get into a food fight on this forum. If that's how the thread is unfolding (like a food fight), then I'm out too! <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> I sure hope it does NOT appear to be that. I'm very interested in getting info about various sources because I do quite a bit of consulting with dog owners who want to modify their dogs' diets. But nothing I read or reported here was meant to be a commentary on ANYone's choices. I hadn't heard of the Common Sense food you mentioned, either. <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" /> Looks like I'm woefully uninformed, because that looks like a good source. QUOTE:   All Natural, Human Grade, Fresh Frozen, Raw Dog Food END Was it the rolls your family didn't like? More handling?
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Michele McAtee wrote 11/15/2006 05:52 AM Re: AFS meat eater diet? [Re: alice oliver ] #117890 - 11/15/2006 05:52 AM
Michele McAtee Webboard User Reg: 02-05-2006 Posts: 1121 Loc: Iowa City, Iowa Offline	I'm with Connie, no food fight for me either. Simply seeking out the pros and cons of this AFS raw food source supplier...reduced to more questions, because, obviously, the raw meat inspection process is vast and to me, filled with considerable, notable unknowns. That's one of the things I love about this forum, that I am inspired to research things I might not otherwise (IE: AFS) and think about things in a different light, essentially learn *a lot* here.
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Eva Czarnojanczyk wrote 11/15/2006 08:50 AM Re: AFS meat eater diet? [Re: Michele McAtee ] #117897 - 11/15/2006 08:50 AM
Eva Czarnojanczyk Webboard User Reg: 10-25-2006 Posts: 320 Loc: Southern CA Offline	4-D is nasty stuff: diseased, deformed, dying...and oops I can't remember the fourth one. I just started my cats (which I just got from the pound) on THK and a high grade kibble. We'll see what the vet bills are like in 10 yrs time good luck with the new pup! "A dog is a mirror of a man's soul"
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Sandy Moore wrote 11/15/2006 09:24 AM Re: AFS meat eater diet? [Re: Eva Czarnojanczyk ] #117899 - 11/15/2006 09:24 AM
Sandy Moore Webboard User Reg: 07-25-2006 Posts: 2665 Loc: AZ Offline	I use Omaspride http://www.omaspride.com . It's raw with bone ground in and veggies added. I like that it has no added supplements, so I can give my own supplements and not have to worry if I'm duplicating. Also don't have to do the math - how much is in a product, how much should be added. Too mind boggling. I also feed RMB's for at least one meal a day. Distributors seems to be everywhere, especially in major cities. As far as quality, here's a quote from their website: "Oma's Pride™ is a division of Miller Foods, a Connecticut-based, family-owned and operated business. Our USDA-inspected and approved meat-processing facility has been producing top quality meat and poultry for the restaurant industry for nearly fifty years. All of our products, including our Oma's Pride raw diet line for animals, are prepared from the same USDA-inspected and APPROVED meat and bones." The product list is endless.
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Cindy Easton Rhodes wrote 11/15/2006 09:46 AM Re: AFS meat eater diet? [Re: Connie Sutherland ] #117901 - 11/15/2006 09:46 AM
Cindy Easton Rhodes Moderator Reg: 07-14-2001 Posts: 2069 Loc: Wisconsin Offline	I would not feed this food. (AFS) Note that many many years ago I was a distributor of this food!!! When I found out the meat is UNFIT FOR HUMAN CONSUMPTION I ditched it. I would say it's been a dozen years or more since I was involved with them. Nice people run the company, I just don't agree with their ideas of what is acceptable for my dogs to eat. Cindy cindyr@leerburg.com
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Amber Morgan wrote 11/15/2006 10:20 AM Re: AFS meat eater diet? [Re: Cindy Easton Rhodes ] #117904 - 11/15/2006 10:20 AM
Amber Morgan Webboard User Reg: 10-18-2006 Posts: 1849 Loc: St. Louis, MO Offline	Wow. Really impressive responses, thank you all! It did seem like a good food to me, too, so I'm glad I asked. I'll go back and try to navigate their complicated website some more. Maybe I'll even write them a letter letting them know why I've chosen not to feed their food. You never know, if enough people speak up, maybe they'll change their policy. It looked like other people provided links to other raw meat diets that are perhaps a little easier to prepare than purchasing everything seperately. I wish I was the kind of person who could do that...maybe some day. Thanks again for your replies. Carbon
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Amber Morgan wrote 11/15/2006 12:16 PM Re: AFS meat eater diet? [Re: Amber Morgan ] #117917 - 11/15/2006 12:16 PM
Amber Morgan Webboard User Reg: 10-18-2006 Posts: 1849 Loc: St. Louis, MO Offline	So I just read some more on the AFS website and found this:  Quote: AFS considers 'select organ meats' essential ingredients to naturally balanced dog/cat nutrition and has emulated these rations into each product formula. AFS Real Raw Meat products Do NOT contain cow brain matter, spinal cord, hair, horns, teeth, eyeballs, intestines, hooves, beaks, bowels, etc.; nor does it contain any 4-D meats/parts (downed cattle) or rendered materials, other hidden ingredients and/or other animal meats not listed on an AFS product label. **Product ingredients are procured from a USDA certified meat processing plant in Northeastern Wisconsin (actually, within the same business complex as AFS), and manufactured using human grade environmental controls for the purpose of maintaining superior pet food product quality and freshness. So just so I have this straight: People are NOT saying that they use 4D meat...they're saying that they use human OR animal grade meat. Question: What does "animal grade" mean if not 4D stuff? They specifically say they don't use 4D meat. And the other problem is that they add charcol. I'm not trying to support them, I just want to be clear on what it is exactly that's wrong with them. Thanks all. Carbon
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