I couldn't help being mad at O for purchasing 3 sibling just because she thought white Goldens were so novel. She's got to be one fo the busiest people on earth so I doubt she has time to train or spend proper time with those dogs.

I had to laugh when she was bragging about how she makes her dogs sit before they get to eat like it was so difficult. Most people's dogs on this forum can bring them a beer.

As for Diamond Jim, the ESS Wesminster winner, I doubt he has any hunting drive. ESS's are either field stock or confirmation stock and they don't even look like the same breed.

IMO O only promoted "cooked" fresh meat so I don't see she did much good for the raw diet. She was to wimpy to handle the raw chicken. You would think at least her personal chef could handle preparing the dog's food.

I was pretty annoyed with the whole show and the celeb trainer was a goofball promoting her PP book. This is why we have so many behavioral problems with aggression. People with aggressive dogs buy into that method and when they fail the end up putting the dog to sleep.

Oprah, you need to bring back Cesar!

If I don't have Brenna's prong on she constantly battles me for who's walking who...as soon as the prong goes on, she's a different dog...one that listens

they can say "yank and crank" all day long...I could give a rip.

Vikki,

I don't believe any Oprah's dog are neglected. They go EVERYWHERE with her. She also has the bank account to hire help if needed.

If you watched show where Cesar helped her with Sophie, he tells her she is not a "leader" in the dog world. HE was actually able to help her with Sophie. (CEsar was on earlier this season.)

I agree with everyone on the trainer. She seems like a complete, well.. nincompoop!

The problem with people is they believe treating a dog like a dog means mistreating them. That is not the case.

Training a dog with the physical power to OVERWHELM you (Pit Bull), physical and mental power to OVERHWHELM you (GSD) or one that can out-think you (Border Collie) is extremely different from training a dog that is always eager to please you (Golden Retriever). Most people fail to realize a dogs training program should be tailored to its temperament and their goals.

If she wanted to get someone who advocates positive reinforcement, she should have hired Jan Fennell. When I heard about her method I was skeptical. I read the book and she is a proponent of pack leadership, granted it is not stated in that way. She does mention wolf-packs and how they live and advocates eating before the dog.

The most important thing about her book is she mentions her methods will not work for every dog and every situation.

Vikki, you should forward your post to the Oprah show. I am with everyone, I think she really needs to do a follow-up. I see more dogs with behavioral problems in our future.

https://www.oprah.com/plugger/templates/BeOnTheShow.jhtml?action=respond&plugId=B2100004

 Quote: carolyn white

Vikki,
The problem with people is they believe treating a dog like a dog means mistreating them. That is not the case.

Training a dog with the physical power to OVERWHELM you (Pit Bull), physical and mental power to OVERHWHELM you (GSD) or one that can out-think you (Border Collie) is extremely different from training a dog that is always eager to please you (Golden Retriever). Most people fail to realize a dogs training program should be tailored to its temperament and their goals.

Couldn't have put THAT better!! well said.

Not to say that there aren't people out there ACTUALLY doing animals harm, but it's an awful shame that "abuse" has such a broad and loose definition these days...

I remember the moment it dawned on me that the 100% positive (and HEAVILY food based), non-correction based methods that were being hammered into me were about as useful in my situation (with a BIG, STONG, INTELLIGENT & INDEPENDANT dog) as trying not to get into an accident in a car with bad brakes by avoiding hilly roads and lots of traffic... I wasn't actually correcting the problems, but offering enough of a distraction to skate along temporarily without incident. You can only go so far with this until you get into an accident (that would be the one day you and your overly excitable, easily distracted and DRIVEN dog come across a real textbook dog-aggressive dog on the sidewalk - and realize you've forgotten your hot dogs on the kitchen counter.)

I'm sure glad I started adding other methods and tools into our training (like pinch collars and proper leadership) - and I'm REALLY glad I don't have to carry hot dogs with me everywhere I go anymore...

~Natalya

As beautiful and friendly as they are, Golden Retrievers can have a mind of their own.

I agree with Louanne, as "pleasant" as people make out a GR to be. They can still overwhelm and drag around a certain person, just as a PB or GSD can be controlled by the right person.

OK, you guys are really confusing the mess out of me. I feed fluffy the crap from a bag, always have, because I don't know a thing about this raw stuff. Many of you promote it so there has to be a reason.

I'm not much for media articles because you never know which advice is good and bad so I ask the following:

How does raw chicken and or pork affect the dogs (ie salmonella etc.)

How does raw chicken, pork, beef etc. bones affect the dogs?

How much more expensive is feeding raw?

Someone mentioned the organs, I think I threw up a little, what's the limit?

Eric,

There are LOADS of threads here on the subject of feeding RAW - all of them very informative and backed up by people who have been successfully using and refining this type of diet for years, on many different breeds - it's a great resource to answer all of the questions you listed

A few short answers to what you aked:

Raw chicken and other meat (including organ meat) is GREAT for your dog's health as it is unadulterated by the processing, cooking and refining that commercial kibble goes through. The protein and nutrients are fresh and easily digested. Leaving poultry bones in the meat for your dog to crunch up helps clean their teeth and adds calcium to the meal. Chicken bones are very pliable when raw and do not hurt the dog during eating & digestion - NEVER feed COOKED bones of any kind as these CAN splinter and be very dangerous.

Kibble is also often full of fillers like corn, wheat and soy, which are not easily digestible and some would argue should not be fed to dogs at all, since it isn't part of a wild carnivore's diet. Some people include vegetables in their RAW diets, some don't. Organ meant though (I know, it's kind of gross - you get used to it though) is very benneficial and packs a whallop of essential vitamins and minerals.

In terms of cost, I think it's all relative. You can spend lot's of money on either type of feeding, if you're so inclined, or you can look for the most cost effective way to give your dog the best nutrition, on a budget that suits you. It can be done.


~Natalya

Eric, why not browse around in the "Feeding an all natural diet" section of the forum first?

The raw-feeding topic has been discussed and hashed-out ad nauseam on this forum and most of the questions that newbies ask have been repeated hundreds of thousands of times over

Better yet, read the article that Cindy wrote on raw feeding (it answers every one of the questions you just asked): http://www.kaiserhaus.com

The article is under "feeding" or "articles"... can't remember for sure, it's easy to find.

Yeah, what Natalya said

I've explained the basics so many times, I no longer have the courage to answer these same questions for the million'th time, lol.

But once you do the basic readings and have more specific questions, I'd be happy to discuss them with you!