Well Michael,
Let's just say that I look at everything with an open mind. The other problem would be that we just have the little freezer in our refrigerator and no place to put a stand-alone freezer. At least at the present time I am feeding Nickie and Roxie Canidae which is on Leerburg's list of good kibbles.

I was just pickin' on ya. Open mind is good. Now that its on your brain, its just a matter of time.....Mwaaaahahahaha!

In a month you'll have a 20 cubic foot deep freeze in the living room by the T.V., and another one in the bedroom. J/K

Not that I, err, have one in my living room or anything like that.

O.k. fine....I needed somewhere to set the T.V.

Edited by Michael_Wise (08/12/2007 04:41 PM)
Edit reason: No, I don't really have a deep freeze in the living room!

 Quote: Diane Joslin

Well Michael,
Let's just say that I look at everything with an open mind. The other problem would be that we just have the little freezer in our refrigerator and no place to put a stand-alone freezer. At least at the present time I am feeding Nickie and Roxie Canidae which is on Leerburg's list of good kibbles.

I always feel compelled to throw it in here that I have fed raw for a long time with no freezer except the one in the 'fridge. I would love to have one of those half-size freezers with a counter top, but I don't have one yet.

It's true that the butcher where I get my basic RMBs and organ meats is two blocks away, but still ... I am proof positive that it can be done, and without much trouble. I come home and re-package everything for a couple of days' worth in each package, but I use heavy freezer baggies and stack them flat. A little over half of my freezer suffices for the dog stuff.

Michael - my bullmastiff Star is only 4.5 months and already 55 lbs. She's a huge puppy (both were huge parents) although not fat. I've never given her a whole chicken but have tried the frozen chicken wings and she swallows them whole also.

Yesterday I needed to feed her in a hurry and didn't have time to grind it up so I gave her three chicken wings, which she chewed for a few seconds and then swallowed them whole. Today she has horrible diarrhea. The really bad kind where she RUNS for the yard to make it in time. I feel so bad for her.

I think part of the problem is that yesterday we ran out of her Orijen kibble. The shop had some sent to me, but with it being a Saturday, for some reason it never arrived. So today we gave her much more meat than her body is used to. But my husband is still blaming it on the chicken bones in her tummy (although the last time she swallowed them whole she didn't have a problem the next day.)

I know bones are good for them to have, but whole chicken bones in a puppy's tummy can't be all that great, huh? How long does that take to digest?

We do give her frozen large bones with meat on them from the butcher shop. She gets one every afternoon as her midday snack. The local butcher here saves the the bones from whatever he chops and puts them in a crate at the end of the counter for the dogs. You can go in and take as much as you want for free. It's great. On Mondays you can literally take half a cow! We freeze the bones to make sure everything is killed off if there is anything parasitic on them, but it does help her with her teething as well.

 Quote: brenda mitchell

We do give her frozen large bones with meat on them from the butcher shop. She gets one every afternoon as her midday snack. The local butcher here saves the the bones from whatever he chops and puts them in a crate at the end of the counter for the dogs. You can go in and take as much as you want for free. It's great.

These sound like what we would call recreational bones. There are different schools of thought about giving recreational bones.

http://leerburg.com/feedingarawdiet.htm#RMB

Giving recreational bones is something that many people do with no problem, but we should be aware that they are *not* what is meant by "RMB" in a raw diet.

 Quote: Brenda Mitchell

Yesterday I needed to feed her in a hurry and didn't have time to grind it up so I gave her three chicken wings, which she chewed for a few seconds and then swallowed them whole. Today she has horrible diarrhea.

You'll see from other threads here that wings (while completely fine for most dogs) are something that many raw feeders don't choose as stand-alone meals. They are mainly skin (fat) and bones.

Again, most dogs are just fine with them, but backs and necks and quarters have a much better ratio of meat to bone-and-fat, I think.

A couple of months ago I had the butcher order me some "knuckle bones" and gave one of those to Nickie. He loved it! It kept him busy for about a half-hour and then I took the small piece away from him.

Then I posted that info on this forum and was advised that some dogs can fracture their teeth chewing on such large bones. So I still have the remaining 4 bones in my freezer. I just don't want to do anything to hurt my pup! (or to cause a huge doggie dental bill - can only imagine what a canine crown would cost!

 Quote: diane joslin

A couple of months ago I had the butcher order me some "knuckle bones" and gave one of those to Nickie. He loved it! It kept him busy for about a half-hour and then I took the small piece away from him.

Then I posted that info on this forum and was advised that some dogs can fracture their teeth chewing on such large bones. So I still have the remaining 4 bones in my freezer. I just don't want to do anything to hurt my pup! (or to cause a huge doggie dental bill - can only imagine what a canine crown would cost!

Yes, my daughter's earth dog has a crown (for that very reason)..... Tufts did a wonderful job, but OMG..... the price tag!!!

But then there are dogs who will chew-chew-chew and be kept busy for ages on the meaty coating, rather than trying to crack the bone open to get at the marrow.....

 Quote: Brenda Mitchell

Michael - my bullmastiff Star is only 4.5 months and already 55 lbs.

Wow! Maybe a whole turkey, or 1/2 an emu!

Seriously though, try a whole chicken. Much less scary than inhaling wings. I used to feed wings alot so I know about watching those things go down in big pieces. My 14 lb. JRT could go through one in about 2 seconds. You will need to make sure she will let you have the rest back if you don't want her eating the whole thing in 1 sitting.

 Quote: Brenda Mitchell

I know bones are good for them to have, but whole chicken bones in a puppy's tummy can't be all that great, huh? How long does that take to digest?

Chicken bones are relatively soft compared to most others you'll feed. Even though she isn't fed exclusively raw, I bet she could handle chicken bones pretty easy.

So far no ill effects from Nickie's first "snack" of raw meat. This evening I found myself inspecting his poop more closely than normal. Just now saw the remains of little pieces of cloth from a toy that he chomped on last night - he spits out most of it but the little pieces of bright purple and pink cloth was a dead give-away!

So to all of you raw feeders - what happened to the bird's beak, the bird's feet, and all the feathers - apparently that stuff all got digested so it is not distinguisable (is that a word??). Just asking because the bird was devoured BEFORE he chewed on the cloth toy.

Anyway, guess I should just relax about the whole episode and maybe the next bird will be a little faster (can't figure out why there were no loose feathers in the yard). I've seen the neighbor's cat catch a bird and there are feathers everywhere!