Quote: vanessa dibernar

Did you know these Petsmart "positive" only training classes are actually teaching "leave it" by bending down and covering up the food with their hand until the dog gets bored and walks away?

- Vanessa

Actually, Ed and I just filmed a segment very much like this yesterday! You don't wait until the dog gets bored and walks away, but you do wait for the dog to quit "mugging" you for the food and then they seem to connect the dots very quickly.

If your dog is clicker savvy you can teach this very easily, I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't tried it myself! All my dogs learned this within several minutes, for some reason it makes sense to them. I have EXTREMELY food driven dogs too.

I use it more as a 'game' to establish a relationship and impulse control with my working dogs/puppies and have a separate word for YUCK (my word for leave it)

So.... my point is don't knock it til you try it!

P.S. I use prongs and ecollars on my dogs too. LOL

I was at Pet Smart on Saturday and there was a "trainer" giving a private lesson to a gal with a boxer.

This "trainer" actually told the gal to approach me and my dog (I was fitting for a new collar) and I stood up and told her not to do that.
Of course I got the "oh he's okay" comment and I continued to tell her not to do that. The lady and the boxer are getting closer and closer as I am asking her not to.

My dogs are taught to ignore other dogs so I was not worried about Rock starting anything since he actually got behind me as this gal was approaching.

I told the "trainer" that I could see why she had a job at Pet Smart as a trainer, since she obviously knew nothing about dog behavior.

Boxer had hackles up, stub up, ears and lips pushed forward and was pulling on the lead. After I pointed this out, I calmy put the collar back on the shelf, went up front and explained to the manager that he needed to look into his employees training techniques and that I probably would not be back.

He went right back and talked to her and before I had gotten in my car to leave (I was talking with a gal about SAR dogs since she saw my signs on my rig) he came out and apologized and let me know that she would be placed on probation and he also gave me a $25 gift card.

I will give them one more chance (after all I have to spend $25 bucks) but I will not take my dogs in again, I will just take the collars out to fit.

I feel like a big bitch, but, can you imagine what would have happened had it been another unsuspecting dog owner with some little Chi dog or the like?

Stupid.....absolutely stupid people.

 Quote:

If your dog is clicker savvy you can teach this very easily, I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't tried it myself! All my dogs learned this within several minutes, for some reason it makes sense to them. I have EXTREMELY food driven dogs too.

This is true. The "click" (or whatever cue you use) is an absoloute precision tool for communication.

This accurately represents first day performance. And yet, I DO toss food to him from a distance (which he takes), it's just that it follows the "click". It's cut and dry, black and white...just how doggies like it.

 Quote: cindy easton rhodes

 Quote: vanessa dibernar

Did you know these Petsmart "positive" only training classes are actually teaching "leave it" by bending down and covering up the food with their hand until the dog gets bored and walks away?

- Vanessa

Actually, Ed and I just filmed a segment very much like this yesterday! You don't wait until the dog gets bored and walks away, but you do wait for the dog to quit "mugging" you for the food and then they seem to connect the dots very quickly.

If your dog is clicker savvy you can teach this very easily, I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't tried it myself! All my dogs learned this within several minutes, for some reason it makes sense to them. I have EXTREMELY food driven dogs too.

I use it more as a 'game' to establish a relationship and impulse control with my working dogs/puppies and have a separate word for YUCK (my word for leave it)

So.... my point is don't knock it til you try it!

P.S. I use prongs and ecollars on my dogs too. LOL

I use this method too! Not afraid to admitt it. It really helped me out when my dog was a pup! I started teaching leave it with corrections, but had way better luck once the dog knew exactly what I was asking for having trained it positively first.


I can assure you my dog is VERY food motivated and I have NEVER trained at petsmart

Nice one Steven, good vid. Posting while I was writing. While I am making confessions, I have always just used marker training, but have been playing around with a clicker recently and Farley and I both think it is FUN!

Ahhhh, feels good to be out of the closet

Well, that's why I use "click" in quotes.

I did buy a clicker, full intending to use it. But then I figured, why use treats when I can just ration the meal itself? Of course that meant wet and messy hands due to raw food, and it just didn't mix with a hand-held thingy. So it was back to the voice.

I am producing a new DVD titled LEERBURG RELATIONSHIP GAMES. As Cindy say's this is one of the games. Until I saw it I thought like some of those who posted here. I was wrong as they are.

 Quote:

Well, that's why I use "click" in quotes.

I did buy a clicker, full intending to use it. But then I figured, why use treats when I can just ration the meal itself? Of course that meant wet and messy hands due to raw food, and it just didn't mix with a hand-held thingy. So it was back to the voice.

I had my clicker since the dog was a pup, it came with some other thing I bought. I thought it was kinda "gay" so I never used it, knowing I could just use marker training. We work outside in the winter and a clicker and treats is just not the most practical. I worked diligently at voice marker training however.

I have just recently started to use the clicker occasionally. I used it to retrain something that the dog was confused about (my fault). Worked so well we decided to keep using it for fun. We use it for fun times, mostly inside, short 10 min sessions. It is good mental stimulation and "relationship buiding" as Ed put it. He loves it, and I am working on my skills and timing, win - win I think. Using the Clicker is just one of the many ob games we play, and a new tool in my toolbox.

As you pointed out it is not practical much of the time and will never replace voice marker training for us.

Woah, this thread has been hijacked

I trained my first dog 50 yrs ago. I can say that I was a very heavy handed trainer. Still have all my Kohler books I bought new in the 60s.
HOWEVER! My last two GSDs are marker trained with NO correction. Does it work? At 3 1/2 yrs old my First GSD has yet to recieve a correction of any kind during training.
VPG1 scores - 91/92/95
AKC CD scores - 190 1/2 - 186 - 191
AKC CDX scores - 193 1/2 - 186 - last one next month
We will be going for our VPG11 in December
Thunder also has his CGC
My 17-18 week old pup Trooper is on a faster pace because this old fart is figuring out Purely Positive.
It works folks!

I would also add that I retrained my 10yr old JRT using marker training and he's a whole new dog.