Quote: kori bigge

Lynne - exactly the problem w/Kodee. I have tried the "grab by the cheeks and stare down", but it escalates his excitement (he has high drive for prey and food both, (he would love it if I'd play rough w/him, which I don't). Forgot to mention that....sorry

lol...well now thats a totally different story then.

You did forget to mention that part!!!

in that case, kori, i would keep a leash on him at all times and use that to control him (as someone had mentioned earlier). I've developed a habit of letting puppies drag a leash indoors at all times, and having that handle available helps great deal!

He's also less likely to get as riled up if you use the leash to control this unwanted behavior, instead of putting your hands directly on him.

 Quote: kacie hackett

He's also less likely to get as riled up if you use the leash to control this unwanted behavior, instead of putting your hands directly on him.

This is so true! and, even more importantly for me, I am able to remain much calmer when I control the pup's behavior w/ the leash as opposed to my hands. (being the novice that I am, I can't help but get riled when those alligator chompers get me!)

I would just like to add that the suggestion for use of the shake can was an entirely sarcastic one.. unless Amber has turned to the dark side, lol :laugh:

Ben: I may disagree with you on a lot of things, but I want you to know that I'd rather have you around expressing your opinions than not have you around, or have you keep quiet. I know it may seem like you get a lot of heat on this forum, and I think we're all pretty vocal about what we believe, but that doesn't mean you should clam up or leave. I do like your posts, even when we don't see eye to eye.

For me, a puppy that is 4 or 5 months old is old enough to be corrected for pack behavior. I equate it to the mother correcting a dog. Dogs aren't sensitive, if a lower ranking member offends a higher ranking member, the higher ranking member doesn't try to distract the lower ranking member, they basically tell them to cut the crap, and they enforce it.

Playing is initiated by higher ranking members, when the higher ranking member feels like it.

That's why I see this behavior as a pack issue, and that's why I'd correct it. I hardly think a cheek scruff is a blowtorch. I think a level 8 - 10 prong is a blowtorch. A cheek scruff is communication.

If the dog is going after your hands, as prey items, I see this as a seperate issue. Have you set a precedent for Hand Play in the past? My mother in law and my wife did this with our sheltie, he goes for hands. This was never done with the GSD, and she only gets hands by accident when she's trying for a tug. She knows that hands are a part of a higher ranking pack member, and the rule is, you don't play with parts of a higher ranking pack member. That's a rule that we established.

Irrespective of whether or not you EVER scruff this dog, you need to teach him that hands are not for playing or biting. You can do this with the standard bite inhibition trick (a strong yelp and ending play) or with corrections. I find that moving my hands slowly and saying "no!" if Noah (sheltie) goes after them tends to work. But he doesn't really go after mine. Just everyone elses. Maybe I should do PPD with HIM....hmmm....

 Quote: Jennifer Marshal

I would just like to add that the suggestion for use of the shake can was an entirely sarcastic one.. unless Amber has turned to the dark side, lol :laugh:

Yes, it was a tongue in cheek reference to our debate with Ben on the other thread involving throwing cans for barking. Ah, what fun that was.

 Quote: David Eagle

For me, a puppy that is 4 or 5 months old is old enough to be corrected for pack behavior. I equate it to the mother correcting a dog. Dogs aren't sensitive, if a lower ranking member offends a higher ranking member, the higher ranking member doesn't try to distract the lower ranking member, they basically tell them to cut the crap, and they enforce it.

Playing is initiated by higher ranking members, when the higher ranking member feels like it.

That's why I see this behavior as a pack issue, and that's why I'd correct it. I hardly think a cheek scruff is a blowtorch. I think a level 8 - 10 prong is a blowtorch. A cheek scruff is communication.

Nicely worded, David.

David-
Thanks for your response. I had not looked at it as pack behavior, but I think you are 100% correct. I don't believe I've set a precedent for hand play - I've made it clear from day 1 that you don't bite my hands. As far as corrections, in Kodee's case, the cheek scruff just gets him more worked up, but a downward yank on the leash and a firm "no" might be better than what I've been doing (verbal "No!" without a leash pop). He doesn't go after my hands, really, but he does seem to go after my arm/wrists if I'm sitting down, or reaching down to pick up a toy for us to play with. If I'm standing up, he nips my ankles, legs. He doesn't bite, but nips hard with his front teeth only (ouch!)

Thanks again for all the suggestions!

 Quote: Kori Bigge

David-
I've made it clear from day 1 that you don't bite my hands. He doesn't go after my hands, really, but he does seem to go after my arm/wrists if I'm sitting down, or reaching down to pick up a toy for us to play with. If I'm standing up, he nips my ankles, legs. He doesn't bite, but nips hard with his front teeth only (ouch!)

Thanks again for all the suggestions!

So, my question is....What did you do to stop him from going after your hands that you cannot do to make him stop going after anything else?

He just never really started going for my hands, actually. When he was little (and short LOL) if I reached for him or something on the floor, and he tried to mouth my hands, a verbal correction was all that it took. But as he got bigger (and started getting rougher and more obnoxious when he wanted to play) he started nipping, and verbal corrections don't work anymore when he's all worked up to play. (He can get like this on his own, while I am doing something else and minding my own beeswax). Verbal corrections DO work with him in other situations (if he's nosing around like he wants to jump up and grab something off the counter, if he starts chewing a table leg, etc) - he'll stop with a "no!" command (usually). The main problem I have is when he gets excited - verbal corrections are pretty useless then.