Since I posted last night about never letting my dogs wander without me present, Little Ember made it halfway onto the kitchen counter after I posted. While she was tethered to me no less.

I was cutting up some raw sirloin to boil for treats and she jumped, hooked her hind legs on the edge of the drawer and was trying to make it all the way.......she did not get anything thank goodness, but I now know, she will probably be the dog I find standing ON the counter here in a few short months if she is loose......

Oh if you guys could just see how fun this post has been for me!!!

Okay, first of all, I will address Mr. John...

Whenever I am going to be gone for an extremely long period of time, when I know the dogs will not be able to go to the bathroom, I will leave them outside with the doggie door shut so they cannot get into the house. Unfortuneatly, I do have a teenage son that borders on ADD half his life and doesn't put the dogs in the kennels like he's supposed to, which is what happened yesterday.

Second of all, I do have a female that has no respect for me or anyone. She is a sneaky, mean little scrapper of a cattle dog that we rescued from a ferrel situation at 4 months of age. She was found w/her sister and the two of them survived in the desert up till that time. She is nothing but doggy and rarely is in the same room as me and my other two dogs that are by my side at all times. I'm usually tripping on them both much to my chagrin but at least I know where they are. Rules that apply to most dogs, rarely apply to her. She can seem like a really sweet dog but underneath she's a devil.

Thirdly, I have an "out of the kitchen rule" standing at all times. All the dogs obey this if I am home. Refer to #1.

Fourthly, Yes, "they" have stated that meat left out to defrost can be an issue but then again "they" say a lot of things about a lot of issues. I've been defrosting this way my entire life, haven't killed anyone yet. lol. I remember butter being on the counter all my life. No one ever died. I gotta tell ya, I really miss having soft butter around. If defrosted correctly, it shouldn't be a problem. The key is to get the thawing process started and then put it in the fridge for the remaining time. I do like the defrost in the sink and the one in the oven! Good ideas! Still, I will concede to John that he was right on this point. I'm a pretty secure person, so I can do that! lol. Just one question, though. Who are "they"?

As far as the kids and the table, here's the issue. My kitchen table sits right in front of my sliding glass door. In order to get out the doggy door there isn't any other way out than to walk by the table. A tempting venture for any dog, to be sure. We have tried to put it someplace else but haven't found any way around where it currently sits. So, the dogs have learned to forage under the table, which creates curiousity "on" the table. Still, If I apply the no freedom rule I suppose it wouldn't happen. By the way, when I came in last night all the dogs, except one, greeted me at the door. When I came around the corner, "she" was standing there looking very submissive and guilty. I knew right away something had happened. When I went to feed the dogs and couldn't find their food on the counter, I went immediately to the back door to look outside. "She" disappeared, when I came back in the house. "She" was already in her kennel. So, "she" knew darn well that she had committed a crime. She's a coyote in dogs clothing. When I walked outside and picked up the chicken container "all" the dogs slinked back into the house in submissive positions, it was clear they were saying "Uh oh". So, I didn't start yelling until I knew they knew. I had been home a while so I don't think my coming home will be associated with my "yelling" and as far as the kenneling. They all ran to their kennels on thier own. I guess because its where they feel "safe" I just closed the doors.

Lastly, I will address JenniferM's comment which was so sweet, lol. Thanks for sticking up for me there, darlin. However, stupid is as stupid does so I suppose I had better tweak a thing or two around here to keep "her" under wraps, probably the teenager too. Perhaps, John, not knowing my writing style didn't realize that I was merely frustrated and that death was only a 'passing' thought for the dog, LMBO!! I will concede many good points were spoken on this thread and I thank all for their good intentions. After all, a well loved person can still be learning tricks for the trade! (glad you think that is so, btw)

Oh yea, hey Carole...you're gonna have some fun with that one! She's a pistol already! To do that tethered to you!! What a stinker! I'm sure it has everything to do with her young age and not her lack of respect for you. Good thing she is in capable hands!

As far as worms...I don't think so. The dog has been this way since the day we got him. Dog doesn't even chew, just exhales. Besides, don't wormy dogs have weight issues in the opposite direction?

My girls don't go in the kitchen at anytime.
They both have e collars and if they walk that way they get zapped.

(The lay out is if they walk in a hallway that only leads to the kitchen)

My older one is up the but the whole time and jewel is on a lead.

But they know I also do that for the babys room which got done yesterday yeah!!!!

They both can jump babys gate so I dont use them.
I need to get them in jumping 5 feet tall and they both jump.

I never mentioned Dogs in the Kitchen
I never have this problem, my two live outside and come in the evening for a short time one after the other
Its the way it was put by Dennis, but reading some of the posts after it seems you Guys over there have a different ways things are put to paper, I suppose its the same as Comidians from the USA, the English do not find there humour at all funny. Now i am thinking of the late Jack Benny, i did not find his gags funny at the time, but he was a clever fellow all the same.
and most people over there in the USA do not find the English Commic's funny. Like for instance Benny Hill or Tommy Cooper
Its the way we were all bought up,
On most points we do agree on things relating to the Dogs but thank goodness not all of it
As regards Cooking
I have been doing it for the last 42 years myself so i know a bit about that and the handling of frozen food, The main point there is not to leave it out of the Fridge once thawed and never to refreeze it once thawed, and most of his working Life, except for the time he spent in the services during the last War, Dad was a Chef, and he taught all us Kids how to Cook From Bread to Cakes of all kinds, and a Four Course Dinner, all Ten of us

Dear Mike: If you have time I would love to hear your training methods on getting your dogs to stop short of the street when chasing a ball, I would love to train my dogs in that area.
Thanks

 Quote: sharon empson

Dear Mike: If you have time I would love to hear your training methods on getting your dogs to stop short of the street when chasing a ball, I would love to train my dogs in that area.
Thanks

My name is not Mike, but my middle name is Michele, so I'm gonna chime in on this one. I teach a "stop" command, and I consider it one of the most important commands. With a stop command, regardless of distance, etc. you can stop your dog from a dangerous action, like another dog, a street, etc.

I start by teaching it on walks, from a heel. At the point I introduce it, they are already stopping when I do. I say "stop" when I stop, then "good stop" when they do. If they don't stop, I correct ("pfui, stop"). Once they have it down on leash, I then work off-leash near a street, and make them stop before crossing, everytime, so stopping at a curb is reinforced and imprinted. I can't tell you how many times it's come in handy, as a few of my dogs are loose quite a bit. They're about to follow me across the street as I go to talk to a neighbor, a car is coming, I say "stop" and they stop. Chasing a cat outside,I say "stop!" and they stop. I have found it a little easier to proof than a full recall where prey is involved.

Edited to say, maybe we should've started a new thread about stopping a dog in motion after a ball or prey item...

Edited by Jenni Williams (01/15/2008 11:11 AM)
Edit reason: maybe we shou ld move this

 Quote: jenni williams

I teach a "stop" command, and I consider it one of the most important commands. With a stop command, regardless of distance, etc. you can stop your dog from a dangerous action, like another dog, a street, etc.

Me too - but since I transferred a hearty amount of horse sense to my dog rearing, we use "whoa!" And I agree about it being much easier to proof than a recall - it's like less work for the dog to just "freeze" than it would be for them to stop what they were doing, turn around, focus on you and then trot away from whatever was so interesting. Very good thing to teach...

~Natalya

Robbin,

You cannot walk in after the fact, see your dogs looking "guilty" and expect them to know why you are angry.

This is akin to the old housebreaking rule - if you find a mess on the floor and did not catch your dog in the act, it is pointless to punish/get mad at/yell at your dog as he does not associate the act of urinating in the house with your anger. You MUST correct within 1.5 *seconds* of the act, otherwise do not correct. All you are doing is destroying your bond with your dogs.

Your dogs are acting submissive because they see your body language getting angry. They have learned that you are unpredictable and when you make that angry body language they are going to get yelled at. They do not know why, only that it is going to happen. What they are doing is called "appeasement" not "guilt" - dogs do not feel guilt. They see their pack leader angry and they try to soothe your anger by acting submissive, hoping to make you somehow less angry. They do not and can not associate your anger with the chicken they ate 20 minutes ago.

The next time you find a chicken wrapper, put the dogs in the yard, roll up a newspaper and hit yourself for not watching them better. Yell in a pillow if you have to but it is not fair to yell at the dogs.

Also, as a certified food handler, I can assure you that what people are saying about thawing your meat is true. Thawing on the counter is dangerous and any restaurant caught doing this would be put out of business. You should thaw your meat in the fridge overnight. Yes it takes longer but it is much safer.

If you insist on thawing your meat at room temperature, and not watching your dogs, I like the idea of putting it in the oven.

 Quote: angela burrell

Robbin,

You cannot walk in after the fact, see your dogs looking "guilty" and expect them to know why you are angry.

I say it depends. Angela's housebreaking scenario is true, but I'm not sure that saying they have no idea what they did is wrong is true. I think that is serious underestimation of a dog's capacity for thought, but then again, I think many common ideas about dogs underestimate them. IMO/IME, to say that a dog can only remember something for a few seconds is ridiculous if you have ever really paid attention to a dog. I have a dog that someone flanked once, 3 years ago. You'd be hard pressed to get near his flank today, although it only happened once. I have a sneak or two like Robbin describes, only one of mine actually runs up to me all submissive and affectionate and silly when he's done something wrong, and I haven't even seen it yet or haven't acknowledged it, so the body language theory doesn't always apply. When my dog ate my bird, he was nowhere to be found when I came home. I didn't even know he'd eaten the bird...he did, and he knew it was wrong. Did I say anything to him? Nope, just cleaned up the few remaining feathers.

So, saying that punishing a dog way after the fact is unfair is true, but I have dogs like Robbin is describing, and call it what you will, but they absolutely know not to do certain things when I'm watching...because they know they would be corrected...because they remember the last time they were corrected for that very thing. No, it's not "guilt" per se, but it is a realization and recollection of a screw-up that Mom isn't going to like. Maybe it's simple apprehension, but if they have that, then doesn't that mean they remember what they did???

However, I do not leave any meat on the counters; my dogs aren't THAT good.