 Re: Maybe a little aggression?
[Re: Mandi Barrett ]
#257613 - 11/24/2009 04:29 PM |
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My situation started much like yours, and even with work and watching them I didn't do enough soon enough and two of my Sweet things have to be totally separated by either leashes, gates or doors AT ALL TIMES!
Otherwise they will try to rip each others throats out. Posturing, nipping, body slamming and biting should never ever be allowed between the dogs, it can escalate quicker than you can ever imagine.
I know they will never ever be alone together, but we are still working towards closely supervised peace.
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Re: Maybe a little aggression?
[Re: Jennifer Lee ]
#257615 - 11/24/2009 04:30 PM |
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They can be together when supervised and I would have the pup on a leash so that you can keep him away from her if necessary.
It is being alone together that is the issue and when a fight could occur at any moment.
Once a serious fight breaks out they may never be safe around each other again.
I would also be working hard at manners, obedience, and pack structure so that you can avoid allowing them to compete with each other over attention.
These things need to be worked on one dog at a time to get the best results.
DITTO.
Mandi, you haven't seen a dog fight, have you? What's going to happen is that one of these dogs will be badly injured (or killed), and the cost of treating a badly injured dog is not just the vet bills -- it's having a dog who is then fear-aggressive forever. That has already started, as your friends have told you. " ... other people seeing them both at the park, mention about how bad Pearl has gotten, but it's to protect herself from her little sister."
You are allowing that to happen.
Cindy (the other half of the "Ed couple") has already responded to you. You are not going to get any different answer from anyone on this board than the near-unanimous responses you have received. This isn't brain surgery. You're arguing against the most basic, nuts-n-bolts protocol for avoiding a dog fight and everything that goes with it.
I applaud you for seeking answers, but they won't help if the extremely experienced folks replying are disregarded.
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Re: Maybe a little aggression?
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#257617 - 11/24/2009 04:35 PM |
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There is nothing worse than having your dogs get in a fight, it is scary dangerous and heartwrenching. These are both wonderful loving gentle dogs.......with everything but each other.
As a small woman who has had to separate three fights between my large dogs I can attest to the danger as can several broken things in our living room, the blood stains on the couch and the scar on my elbow.
Thank goodness no one was seriously hurt, it could have been so much worse.
My two were fine for a very long time, but as the younger one matured and postured the other one got scared and defensive.
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Re: Maybe a little aggression?
[Re: Mandi Barrett ]
#257619 - 11/24/2009 04:41 PM |
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Connie, Ruby isn't aggressive just a sweet thing, who nips. I think you are blowing it all out of proportion. But thanks for your time, I'd like to hear from Ed
You've gotten great advice here, and although I'm not Ed, the fact that I answer 99% of his emails should tell you something.
Keep your dogs separated when you can't supervise! I'd also recommend learning more about pack structure and leadership, use the search engine on the left side of every page of the website.
Ed's put this forum in place so folks can get advice while he's busy producing videos. It seems to me that you don't like the answers you've been given and you are making excuses for your dogs. This is not going to help you with your problem, and you do have a problem brewing.
"A sweet thing, who nips" = aggressive.
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Re: Maybe a little aggression?
[Re: Mandi Barrett ]
#257620 - 11/24/2009 04:42 PM |
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... I looked for training help, and found Ed, and so far like his methods. ... But thanks for your time, I'd like to hear from Ed
Here you go (quoting Ed):
"People can have more than one dog if they do it right. I currently have 10 or 12 dogs and we are raising 3 puppies. But they are all kenneled separately and we do not allow them to play together. The only time I ever recommend 2 or 3 dogs being together is when there is the PACK LEADER there that the dogs respect to control their behavior."
"Pack leader" means the human in charge.
http://leerburg.com/groundwork.htm
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Re: Maybe a little aggression?
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#257629 - 11/24/2009 05:16 PM |
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Thank you everyone, like i initially said, I am a newbie on this site and with the Leerburg method, but will heed all your advise, as from.....NOW!
Thanks
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Re: Maybe a little aggression?
[Re: Jennifer Lee ]
#257631 - 11/24/2009 05:20 PM |
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They can be together when supervised and I would have the pup on a leash so that you can keep him away from her if necessary.
It is being alone together that is the issue and when a fight could occur at any moment.
Once a serious fight breaks out they may never be safe around each other again.
I agree with this and everyone elses advice not to leave the dogs together unsupervised.
But I have seen, or known of, serious bitch fights winding up in one bitch dead and other badly injured on several occasions.
I would also be working hard at manners, obedience, and pack structure so that you can avoid allowing them to compete with each other over attention.
These things need to be worked on one dog at a time to get the best results.
I agree!
We are all trying to help you. Many of us have had lots of experience. I have been involved in dog training for 40 yrs. What starts out as posturing turns to nips. Nips turn to fights. To ignore this is asking for a heartbreak down the road.
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Re: Maybe a little aggression?
[Re: Joy van Veen ]
#257633 - 11/24/2009 05:42 PM |
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What she said. 
I know you don't see how separating them "teaches" them how to be "pals."
"So when will they be allowed together, they're pals too." When you're with them, after you've learned about pack structure and leadership. You're going to find as you read the LB site (articles, podcasts, videos) what these answers mean in the way you live with your dogs.
As you have been living with them, they were well on the way to having to be separated forever. Jennifer hit it right on the button:
I would also be working hard at manners, obedience, and pack structure so that you can avoid allowing them to compete with each other over attention.
What they learn, you want to be learned from you.
It is not the older dog's job to protect herself (by nipping and then escalating). It's your job. You are the pack leader. You were demonstrating that there is no pack leader, and that they were on their own.
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Re: Maybe a little aggression?
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#257636 - 11/24/2009 06:11 PM |
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Here's how to make even better use of this thread: Let's focus on how you train these dogs, not just in basic obedience but in pack structure ... so that you can work towards having a calm and non-aggressive (no "nipping") pack.
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Re: Maybe a little aggression?
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#257638 - 11/24/2009 06:38 PM |
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