Let me address Richard I did debate this issue on the forum that it was originally posted. I made my point and he made his. But his last statement brought about me looking for others input.
His quote "As I said, it is interesting learning what others believe."**
The reason I reposted it or a portion of it here is because he put out confusing biases. That constantly compare the GSD to other dogs, and reason why its so popular (RS grooming it major drawback) and stories of GSD weakness like not protecting their masters. Then there are numerous quotes that the GSD is still the most versitle working dogs work available. He agrees it is the standard most dogs are compared to.
Now I've seen the RS work its an outstanding protection dog, but it won't stop, cleanly that I've seen. The Giant trully wants to fight. And if measuring tenacity and courage its an outstanding animal. There are numerous other dogs that have these traits, the RS is one of these powerful animal. No doubt.
But the debate is not dog vs. dog it is that a stuborn character trait can be thought of as intelligent factor? Doing what it wants to and not following commands.
This boarder cloer to un-dependable to me, which does not make a great team. Nor does it shows that the dog wants to or will do the work dependably.
I agree a test that proves that one dog is easier to train then another may not be a good general test of intelligence, but if being able to communicate and understand is the ground work for learning then it does prove which dog can be taught the quickest. The next test would be which dog can use this knowledge to perform more difficult task, making it the most versitle.
Almost like (but not quite) after learn your alphabetic, now you can learn to spell, read and write. If its harder to teach these basic, it will slow down the learning process. Does this measure intelligence probably not, but does it show an aptitude for the various task at hands, certainly.
I usually tell the story, of when some of my younger brothers friends wanted me to help teach Ob to their 4 (10wk - 3 month old) pit bulls one at a time. These were some of the hardest head suckers that I've ever worked, they had intense food drive and stuborn. It took me a hour each (15 minutes on and rest) to teach a sit (without them poping up). Did I think they were intense/powerful and cute sure, did I think he was smart "hell no". Not compared to the numerous of 8-10 week GSD/Rot/Lab that could learn the sit in less then 2 minutes.
Dog Intelligence, Its obvious like beauty, it to the beholder. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />