Re: Aggressive 8 month old GSD
[Re: Michael Croell ]
#26405 - 09/25/2003 08:56 AM |
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Originally I thought that the first couple replies to my initial post was misinterpreted and that the responses were an overreaction to a couple incidents of an immature dog.
BUT......since there have been so many responses and they pretty much say the same thing, I have been forced to reevaluate my position. Although I still don't think the problem is as extreme as some of the replies imply, I don't want the problem to get worse. I have contacted a local training school. Fortunately there is a school that trains K9 police dogs about 20 minutes from me. I'm going to take him there for some one-on-one training and see what they think.
A have had many dogs throughout my life, but never a dog with a dominant personality like this one.
Why do you have this dog? What are his bloodlines?If it for a pet only then perhaps you may want to reconsider and place the dog with a more experienced handler and start over with a softer dog. A strong working GSD is not meant to be a pet, but rather should have a job to do. You may think you can change gentics, but you can't. My dog is from a breeder in my area. I did some research before choosing a dog. I am interested in getting involved in Schutzhund training. I have purchased a couple videos and have been talking to a local club. My intention was to get the dog involved in some professional training, but was waiting until he was proficient in basic obedience before I got that serious. Apparently now would be the time to get an experienced trainer involved. My intentions were to do everything right from the beginning, but obviously I have already made some big mistakes.
Thanks all for the advice.
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Re: Aggressive 8 month old GSD
[Re: Michael Croell ]
#26406 - 09/25/2003 09:30 AM |
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Mike I totally agree with Lisa S. Now on to a new issue, you let him go after you as prey OH HELL NO!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> Do you have any ideas the mixed mesages you are sending this poor dog? Obviously NOT. You never ever as a handler allow your dog to go after you as prey or to bite you! You are now weak in the eyes of your dog. It won't be long before he claims the title of Alpha-you are now without a doubt reinforcing the negative behaviors that you are so concerned about. You need some serious help with your dog and quick. I don't think he is a blood thristy dog I think he is a baby that is becoming a teenager who is being sent messages by his owner that he will be Alpha one day.
You want to work on prey drive that is fine but not you as the prey. You need to remember that he is going through a stage where he is going to test you for Alpha more then he did before, (at least mine did) and you can not give him an inch-nor can anyone in your family. I am very very concerned about the children now because this is a dog that does not know what is prey and what is not, he is a back biter so when he goes after your kids they won't even know that it is coming. Think of your children first-use the brains and common sense god gave you in teaching your dog. PLEASE get some help!
A dog is the only thing on earth that loves you more than he loves himself. -Josh Billings |
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Re: Aggressive 8 month old GSD
[Re: Michael Croell ]
#26407 - 09/25/2003 12:36 PM |
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Michael,
What specifically makes you think your dog has a dominant personality?
The predatory behavior? Well....that's not dominance; it's him being a dog. All dogs engage in predatory behavior, even soft submissive ones.
The possessive aggression? Not dominance either. Even insecure dogs lacking confidence can develop this habit.
The dog aggression? Not to beat a dead horse, but that's probably fear resulting from undersocialization, not dominant behavior.
Your dog may indeed be a dominant type, but none of the behavior problems you have described are really giving me that impression. There may be some confusion in the dog's mind about rank and where he fits in, but again, that doesn't neccessarily make him dominant. Considering that he is 8 months old, it would be about the right time for him to be testing rank, which, again, is not dominance, it is being a dog (or rather, being a puppy growing up into a dog). This is where consistently enforced house rules come into play.
I could be completely and thoroughly off base here, but since I'm just reading your descriptions over the internet and not actually seeing your dog in person, it would be understandable for me to be wrong. I'm glad you are going to consult with a professional, because that's really what you need to be doing. Best of luck to you, and please update us on your progress.
Lisa & Lucy, CGC, Wilderness Airscent
Western Oregon Search Dogs |
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Re: Aggressive 8 month old GSD
[Re: Michael Croell ]
#26408 - 09/25/2003 01:45 PM |
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Karmen,Dante,Bodie,Sabre,Capone
http://www.vogelhausgsd.com
Abraxas
6/29/91-9/22/00
"Some dogs come into our lives and quietly go,
others stay awhile and leave paw prints on
our heart and we are never the same" |
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Re: Aggressive 8 month old GSD
[Re: Michael Croell ]
#26409 - 09/25/2003 01:52 PM |
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By the way Mike what are the bloodlines on your puppy? I might help us better understand his behavior..Thanks
Karmen,Dante,Bodie,Sabre,Capone
http://www.vogelhausgsd.com
Abraxas
6/29/91-9/22/00
"Some dogs come into our lives and quietly go,
others stay awhile and leave paw prints on
our heart and we are never the same" |
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Re: Aggressive 8 month old GSD
[Re: Michael Croell ]
#26410 - 09/25/2003 02:52 PM |
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My dog is from a breeder in Indiana called Enckhausen Shepherds. Their web site says that they deal strictly with imports specializing in East German and Czech. lines.
Sire: Hegus vom Enckhausen
Dam: Cheiko z Veku CS (import)
I scheduled a one-on-one session at Landheim Training Center for Monday. It's difficult to find a good trainer and I guess you never know until you see the progress. This trainer has been training police dogs for 20+ years. We'll see how things go.
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Re: Aggressive 8 month old GSD
[Re: Michael Croell ]
#26411 - 09/25/2003 04:42 PM |
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Mike, good luck to you, I hope everything works out, and I commend you for being able to be clear headed about the behaviours now. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
No one ever said life was supposed to be easy, life is what you make of it!! |
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Re: Aggressive 8 month old GSD
[Re: Michael Croell ]
#26412 - 09/25/2003 04:42 PM |
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Mike I know the kennel and the people who run it, Mike Diehl and his partner Shelby Yeakle. I also know Hegus and that Bruce McNabb recently put the SchH I on the dog. He is a Stomrfront's Brawson son. You have some very tough bloodlines so I can see where the dominance and the aggression come from. Please keep us posted on your progress with your dog.
Karmen,Dante,Bodie,Sabre,Capone
http://www.vogelhausgsd.com
Abraxas
6/29/91-9/22/00
"Some dogs come into our lives and quietly go,
others stay awhile and leave paw prints on
our heart and we are never the same" |
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Re: Aggressive 8 month old GSD
[Re: Michael Croell ]
#26413 - 09/26/2003 09:18 AM |
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Karmen,
I have talked to Shelby Yeakle at great length and to Mike Diehl a couple times. I've discussed visiting their club (WISPC). Do you have any other information about the club? Heard any good or bad? Although it's about 2 hours from me, it's probably the closest and I wonder if the commute would be worthwhile.
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Re: Aggressive 8 month old GSD
[Re: Michael Croell ]
#26414 - 09/26/2003 10:28 AM |
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Given they bred your pup, it is probable that they are more knowledgable about the traits coming from the lines than someone else. Frankly, and I may be slammed for this, this type of pup would not be my first choice for a family companion pup! Unless you were looking for a sport prospect that is!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> Many many people drive long distances to train in this country - I pretty much have done a 200 mile round trip for about 2 years now twice a week and know others that do the same.
As far as waiting to start schutzhund training with a young drivy pup - tug work, confidence building etc is very common, and very useful in understanding what it takes to train and title any dog - it also gives you help and guidance in developing the dogs social personality right at the beginning from someone who is experienced and would have recognized the behavior and probably helped you deal with it without having any incidents. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> I would HIGHLY recommend you go back to the breeders club for training.
Lee Hough
SG Kyra v Frolich Haus, SchH3, CD, KKL1
SG Kougar, SchH1, AD, CD - by V Xito v d Maineiche
Fenja v Wildferdelande, SchH2, AD
Bianka v Spitzbubezwinger, IP1 by Ufo v Guys Hof
http://www.wolfstraum.net |
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