I never liked the idea of a prong myself but did get one a few weeks ago... I LOVE using it. And I do think is one of the most affective/kindest ways of giving correction. I made a DD collar and used it but the prong has been better than that (partly because of my lack of understanding). I work mostly off leash but when I go to a public place I have used the prong and had very little trouble. I also have been reinforcing with treats at the same time mostly. I would give it a try after some good marker training/pack structure to get things back on the "positive" road.

Here is the link that has a picture of how to put both the prong and DD collars on together. The picture is about half way down titled "Recommended Safety System"

http://leerburg.com/fit-prong.htm

Jethro has 'graduated' back to his Starmark collar (which I still back up with a loose DD collar). The prong collar is supposed to be nice and snug up behind the dog's jawline, with Jethro that lasted for about 3 steps and then it would have slipped down his coat. I used a little clip strap between the back up collar and the leash, so both the prong collar and the back up collar were clipped into the leash, but the prong collar would take the correction, while there was slack to the back up collar (ie. not getting tightened on two collars at once).

We found the prong collar was self-correcting, in that Jethro would hold himself back from lunging rather than take the pinch from the collar. This was enough breathing room to work on re-directing his attention and getting him to reframe his focus.

I like using different collars, they give Jethro something to think about, and to make new choices.

In terms of unwanted prey drive (cars, other dogs, squirrels, etc.) and unwanted territorializing (in-house) I have found the Look at That behaviour has been a life safer. The way it works is I don't force Jethro not to look at something that has caught his eye. I encourage him by saying, "Look at That" and clicking as he looks. At the sound of the click, he looks back at me for a treat, and I give him one. Thus, environmental distractions are turning into treats from me. It teaches him he can look, but not lunge, bark or chase.

It is due to his success with this exercise that he has been able to go outside without his prong (at least for the time being).

Thanks for all the input! great information. Just got my tracking number and have until tuesday for my dvd and other stuff from leerburg to arrive. We seem to be doing ok though for now.

I will consider changing my mind on the prong collar in the future, but I don't really see us going anywhere public for awhile. We are going to be doing two a days in the empty living room and in the backyard in the afternoons until we can get some foundational work accomplished

Even though these are good prong posts, I agree with you. I think a prong on this dog right now might well be fuel on a fire.

But you have to be sure the dog has enough structured exercise to replace power-walks for this period, and/or maybe take her to and walk in a less populated area or at odd times.

Adding lack of exercise to this would be a disaster.

So .... fetch sounds good ..... for starters.

And short upbeat marker sessions (frequency way trumping length of sessions).



JMO.

Sounds good, I have several little breaks in the day to get those in. And whenever the weather is nice she plays out back and burns off a lot of her extra energy (great new fence)

It will probably be a month minimum until i consider a prong, or really walks outside the confines of our house backyard, there are a lot of stray dogs running around, and lot of houses with poor front yard fences that a chihuahua could jump which makes it difficult to do things in our neighborhood anyway

 Quote: Jeffrey Hill

Thanks for all the input! great information. Just got my tracking number and have until tuesday for my dvd and other stuff from leerburg to arrive. We seem to be doing ok though for now.

I will consider changing my mind on the prong collar in the future, but I don't really see us going anywhere public for awhile. We are going to be doing two a days in the empty living room and in the backyard in the afternoons until we can get some foundational work accomplished

Totally agree you don't need the prong now, just good to consider for the future. Kudos to you for really listening and taking the advice everyone is giving you! Too many times posters only want to hear that they are doing everything right and don't stick around to get help. I think the videos/marker training and the advice of the members here will be the best thing that ever happened for you and your dog! It was for me keep us updated!

Eta: love the pic! She's beautiful!

 Quote: Jeffrey Hill

.... every other week we still do recall training at least 1 day with it out in our cul de sac to make sure she stays good on that command ....

You know, I must be skimming or dozing not to have caught this first time around.

You know that the recall isn't a once-every-week or once-every-other-week thing, right? I mean, the recall is something you do all the time. Every day, all the time, you reinforce this: when you call the dog and she comes to you, great stuff happens.

You want the dog to perk up her ears and come flying to you when she hears you call her, because she knows how great it will be, right?

You don't get this with a long-line session every other week.

The only reason I had been doing it like that is that we were beginning to work on different things, now it will be an every day activity again.

Off-topic, but holy fack that is a gorgeous little girl, Jeff!