Quote: will rambeau

Jessica, I'm going to respond here since you're obviously talking about me:
First off, I'm not "bragging" about walking my dog while carrying a firearm - this is Idaho and you obviously know *nothing* about our culture here - I carry a firearm openly on my hip while I grocery shop, visit my doctor, and go to the bank, and so do a significant number of people in my town ( and State ). There have been many times while eating at our local diner that I've noticed that 50% of the patrons are armed, it's just the way things are here and we have a very low crime rate, most likely secondary to this.

I've had a bobcat on my property 35 feet from my door, a wolf pack less than a mile away, and we've had two mountain lions sleeping on our city park gazebo - yeah, I'm going to carry a firearm, it's legal, it's my Constitutional right, and maybe it'll save my dogs or I someday from harm.

Oh no Will, don't get me wrong. I don't condemn you at all. I have also been known to carry for the same reason. And you and I are not the only two here (but I will admit that you were the first that came to mind ) It is I also carry at work when I am going to vacant homes and crapy neighborhoods. I happen to live with a retired instructor from Front Sight and have been well trained and am a better shot than half of the department. I have and always will carry a gun and am a firm believer of the second amendment.

And Will, you have been carrying and recommending it before you moved to the wilds of Idaho. I have been around long enough long enough to remember before, during and after your move. Even have some of your recipes saved from you days at culinary school. So don't try to claim that it is *just* the culture in Idaho that gives you leave to carry. Again, I don't question it at all.... You are making some pretty big assumptions to say that I know *nothing* about your culture. I have a sister and two nieces living in Idaho. My family owns several houses there and it is a place that I visit at least three weeks out of the year. I am familiar and comfortable with the culture and was not casting aspirations on your choices, now or when you were in Florida.

My point was that carrying a gun for protection, to include protecting your dog from attack, is something that is often talked about here and not only accepted, but lauded as the smart thing to do if you are in a dangerous situation. But the moment a cop does the same thing he is being crucified.

No need to get defensive here. I never said your name, there was no criticism or condemnation and to be honest I my comments regarding being armed could have applied to many other members here, including me. I don't see why you are getting defensive. At all. I think it was clear from what I wrote where I stand on the topic and it wasn't anti guns or second amendment...

Jessica,
I guess calling cops candy wimpy ass's was unwarranted except for maybe the ones shooting weenie dogs and dogs in crates. There's always a few bad eggs ruining it for all the outstanding LEO out there.
I have been a ride alongs with a friend of mine and loved it, he encouraged me to become a PO and actually went and took the test in LA but my racing was more important to me and never took it any further, then after my parents were killed going to a race I kinda got lost.
Probably would have failed the psych test being the candy wimpy ass I am.

 Quote: john axe

Well said Jessica

I also think that’s an excellent post Jessica.

I haven’t looked at any of the links including the original post so this post may be a little out of context. I am aware of things that go on and quite frankly, it breaks my heart. I’ve learned my lesson and have exceeded my Kleenex bill this year so I stayed away from clicking on these ones.

Yes… we only get the side of the story we hear/read about or that we “choose” to listen to. We develop opinions based on our limited or vast experiences.

It’s funny about the gun laws in Canada. Everybody (including our own citizens) thinks “Woooo, they sure tightened up there”. Well I’m here to tell you that east side of our country views these laws much differently than many of us do here in the west. The bigger cities are much the same (where only the criminals have/carry guns) but the northern areas are full of gun toting, law abiding citizens. I won’t get into it but there are firing ranges all across this country and our transport permits indiscriminately authorize transport to each one.

No we can’t wear them “visibly” on our sides as we go out for lunch, do our banking or sit through a church sermon but.... let’s just say they’re often very close. Its hunting season right now and you’d be hard pressed to find a pickup truck in our area that wasn’t carrying a rifle/shotgun of some sort.

As Mr. Rambeau says, it’s a culture that a few of us live - have grown up with and are as comfortable with as carrying a leash. (actually I love the non-reactiveness of my firearms, no independent thought, they’re quiet, ready when I need them and gun oil is a lot cheaper than dog food), but I digress.

I have a couple of big boys that have never been in a dog fight (well an 83 lb’er too but we’ll keep him out of this equation because he’d fall over if a dog barked too loud in his direction). Things happen all the time and I’ve been fortunate but we also run the tightest management ship we can navigate. We get called “over the top” all the time but we also have safe, healthy, well adjusted boys where other dogs are concerned.

I’ve played out a dog fight, in my mind, through various different scenarios on many occasions. What would I do in this situation sort of thing. It sounds like the owner and more than one officer were present and only the two dogs. I’ve seen Mr. Frawley’s “back leg break up” work with a Doberman and a Staffy. Along with quickly yelling “Don’t shoot”, as an owner, I’d have been on my dog’s back legs in seconds.

Hind sight and “quarter back arm chairing” are always 20/20. Had this been me “alone” or my husband for sure, this particular attacking pit bull may also not be alive today. Pure speculation and seconds in a situation like this count – many, many things to take into consideration.

Decisions like this also injure and take human lives every day. We are all human and not infallible of making the wrong choices. We also tend to judge each other very harshly. But for the grace of God there go we.

And as Jessica says, until we’ve walked a few feet in these officer’s boots, do we really have the right, the gall, the nerve to pass judgment on them.

 Quote: CJ Barrett

And as Jessica says, until we’ve walked a few feet in these officer’s boots, do we really have the right, the gall, the nerve to pass judgment on them.

I like to walk a mile in other's shoes before passing judgement.

That way, when I do pass judgement, I'm a mile away and they don't have any shoes.

LOL… you’re just too funny. I don’t know, some of those guys are pretty big… I'm not sure I could get a mile in their boots without tripping and falling.

I’d probably look pretty silly yelling some passing judgment flat of my face but I must say, the thought of some bad apple at a disadvantage without his foot ware brings a strange smile to my face.

What?! Blame the owner? He let his dog out off leash because he was ORDERED to do so! Ya, that guy is a GIANT Do*^che who has no business owning that type of untrained dog, but stupidity is not against the law. His dog was contained until the cops told him to turn it loose. Yes, he should have better obedience training on his dog, but that's not the law! I wish you had to pass an intelligence test to own a dog, or have a kid, but that's not the law, either! The K9 cop could of passed that dude HIS leash, if his dog is so awesomely trained.... That guy was cooperating to the best of his ability. He shouldn't be punished for that. This is excessive use of force no matter which way you slice it.

P.S. I hope that idiot never owns a Pit Bull again.....

Kinda my thoughts, too.

 Quote: Lisa Brazeau

What?! Blame the owner?

Lisa… I sure hope you don’t think I was blaming owner because that was certainly NOT my intention. Only that’s it’s often very difficult to judge the moment to moment thought processes and actions playing out in a critical, emergency type situation like this.

As has been commented, so many things could have and should have heppened differently to prevent this unfortunate tragedy.

The lack of a leash is a secondary problem here.

The pit didn't even have a collar on, nothing for anyone to grab onto and control the animal with.

This just illustrates the importance of being responsible pet owners and training our dogs. When a dog is harmed due to owner irresponsibility there is no one the owner can blame but themselves.

No, CJ. I responded to your post when I was generally responding to the 'LEO's gotta do what they gotta do' statements.

As usual the devil is in the details...

 Quote: jessicakromer

My point was that carrying a gun for protection, to include protecting your dog from attack, is something that is often talked about here and not only accepted, but lauded as the smart thing to do if you are in a dangerous situation. But the moment a cop does the same thing he is being crucified.

The difference here is the THE COPS put themselves (and their K9) in the dangerous situation.

If the story was "Will Rambeau walked over to the mountain lions in the Gazebo to wake them up. Then he shot it with his side piece because it attacked him..." I would definitely take issue with that.

That poor stupid dog saw another intact male dog being assertive (barking and lunging as K9's are encouraged to do) in his driveway and went out there to defend his territory. ANY dog (not just a pit or dog aggressive dog) would probably react the same way. Had that same dog attacked (defending territory) the perp who dropped the gun in the yard they would probably be calling him a hero. And then of course the perp would sue for the bite....