 Re: Thinking of getting a working line GSD
[Re: Lee Hanrahan ]
#210446 - 09/21/2008 10:40 PM |
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"Other Titles" isn't very specific, but no, as I stated, I believe in the SV standard of breeding and think all dogs bred should have a breed survey.
Ring sports, mondio, SAR cert., PSD certs, ect...you get the point. There are SOO many other things out there other than schutzhund. What about those dogs who HAVE proven themselves but dont have time to do a breed survey, when they have a REAL job to do or those who participate in other "protection" sports. I just hate when people are so narrow minded. Everyone has different goals for their breeding program and as long as a GSD is working it shouldnt matter what title or cert. (and I mean REAL titles not CGC's or AKC stuff) is behind their name. JMO
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Re: Thinking of getting a working line GSD
[Re: Aleida Cebreco ]
#210447 - 09/21/2008 11:05 PM |
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A dog can qualify for a breed survey with herding, police or schutzhund titles. I would like to see the SV recognize titles from ring and KNPV, unfortunately for now, they don't. Unfortunately right now this isn't a big problem since you don't see many GSDs titling and participating in these sports.
To qualify for a breed survey a dog must have recieved at least an SG rating in conformation as well as have passing hips and elbows.
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Re: Thinking of getting a working line GSD
[Re: susan tuck ]
#210450 - 09/22/2008 12:08 AM |
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Hips and elbows should be a must for ANY breed. I was just making the point that GSD's are a very well rounded working breed that can do almost anything. Breed surveys only cover a fraction of what a GSD is capable of and if that was the mentality of ALL GSD breeders, they would loose the versality the breed now holds and what made me fall in love with them. Again JMO
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Re: Thinking of getting a working line GSD
[Re: Aleida Cebreco ]
#210458 - 09/22/2008 09:02 AM |
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First of all, I am not "narrow minded" - I stated that I believe in the SV standard of breeding - if it's good enough for the rest of the world then it's good enough for me.
I also never said that a breed survey is ALL that a dog should have to be bred - it is the MINIMUM that a dog requires to be bred and breeders "who don't have the time" to get one should find another hobby IMO.
I am tired of all the excuses breeders give for why they don't do the minimum required to breed a dog. If a dog is worthy of being bred, then the breeder can take the time to prove it on paper. I will not take a breeder's word for how great their dogs are just as I won't take a vets word on xrays - they should be submitted to the OFA, SV etc...
The SV has a standard, any breeder can lower it to suit them, as a purchaser I don't need to lower mine.
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Re: Thinking of getting a working line GSD
[Re: Lee Hanrahan ]
#210459 - 09/22/2008 09:22 AM |
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Lose versatility? This is the reason for the 3 phases in the schutzhund test, to show the dog is versatile. Almost every breeding dog in Germany is breed surveyed and has been for multiple generations, show or working line.
You can breed without KKL, and get white papers, but basically no one does in Germany. You might not like the fact that it is a hassle and there may be room for improvement in the system, but throwing the baby out with the bathwater is not the answer, you end up with dogs like the ASS.
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 Re: Thinking of getting a working line GSD
[Re: susan tuck ]
#210460 - 09/22/2008 09:45 AM |
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yeah, what she said! 
I agree with you completely Susan!
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Re: Thinking of getting a working line GSD
[Re: susan tuck ]
#210461 - 09/22/2008 09:53 AM |
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Minor correction, the dog only needs a 'G' show rating, not an 'SG'.
Since most working dogs are automatically relegated to the 'G' group at shows, requiring an SG would elminated that strain from the breed. The current judging style favors the shaggy, black & red, slightly over-sized version of the German Shepherd.
To qualify for a breed survey a dog must have recieved at least an SG rating in conformation as well as have passing hips and elbows. |
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 Re: Thinking of getting a working line GSD
[Re: Charlie Snyder ]
#210462 - 09/22/2008 10:12 AM |
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The current judging style favors the shaggy, black & red, slightly over-sized version of the German Shepherd.
Then I would think WL people would be happy with a G 
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Re: Thinking of getting a working line GSD
[Re: Lee Hanrahan ]
#210466 - 09/22/2008 10:55 AM |
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Thank you Charlie, I stand corrected.
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Re: Thinking of getting a working line GSD
[Re: Lee Hanrahan ]
#210496 - 09/22/2008 03:50 PM |
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First of all, I am not "narrow minded" - I stated that I believe in the SV standard of breeding - if it's good enough for the rest of the world then it's good enough for me.
I also never said that a breed survey is ALL that a dog should have to be bred - it is the MINIMUM that a dog requires to be bred and breeders "who don't have the time" to get one should find another hobby IMO.
I am tired of all the excuses breeders give for why they don't do the minimum required to breed a dog. If a dog is worthy of being bred, then the breeder can take the time to prove it on paper. I will not take a breeder's word for how great their dogs are just as I won't take a vets word on xrays - they should be submitted to the OFA, SV etc...
The SV has a standard, any breeder can lower it to suit them, as a purchaser I don't need to lower mine.
I never said they were doing it as a hobby, you know people who use their dogs for REAL work, not a game. I never said you had to lower your standard for purchasing a dog, but dont put down other dogs because they dont have a breed survey, because their owners decided to pursue a different sport or activity with their dogs. Have you SEEN schutzhund lately?? Do you honestly believe half those dogs are breed worthy?? Why do you think SOOO many people are switching from Schutzhund?? Because its become a joke an a mockery of the german shepherd breed. Sorry if I can title a dog up to a French Ring III, or any other title of equivelence makes my dog just as capable (key word if).
I personally, rather see the dog work in person and make my decision based on that than just assuming because a dog has a Sch title its a true working dog.
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