 Re: A Dumb Question on Working vs. Show lines
[Re: Joy van Veen ]
#258647 - 12/05/2009 10:57 AM |
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In many breeds, the longer coats (whether actually long or just plush) seem to often go with mellower dogs.
Which breeds? It certainly not something I's seen in Border Collies
BTW, I sit typing this with a bored 10.5 y/o rough coated dog who keeps coming and pestering me. She has been for a hard 15 minute run, another 15 minutes of ball then sheep chores. It is less than she'd like to do, but I try to restrict her a bit due to some heart problems she has.
Then there's the rough coated teenager I have ...  She makes my active smoothie look like a house pet 
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Re: A Dumb Question on Working vs. Show lines
[Re: Mara Jessup ]
#258648 - 12/05/2009 11:20 AM |
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This probably doesn't add much, but there was a fluffy (rough coated, I guess I should say) Corgi that was titled in Schutzhund. I've looked online but can't find anything on it anymore. Supposedly the dog was a painter too. I don't know about the painting, but I'm assuming a Corgi would need to be fairly un-mellow for that! Maybe it's just with Collies?
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Re: A Dumb Question on Working vs. Show lines
[Re: Mara Jessup ]
#258667 - 12/05/2009 03:09 PM |
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In many breeds, the longer coats (whether actually long or just plush) seem to often go with mellower dogs.
Which breeds? It certainly not something I's seen in Border Collies
BTW, I sit typing this with a bored 10.5 y/o rough coated dog who keeps coming and pestering me. She has been for a hard 15 minute run, another 15 minutes of ball then sheep chores. It is less than she'd like to do, but I try to restrict her a bit due to some heart problems she has.
Then there's the rough coated teenager I have ... She makes my active smoothie look like a house pet
The breed I have the most experience with is the GSD. Many GSD trainers have noticed a much higher percentage of the plush, laangstockhaar (long stock coat), and laanghaar (long hair); are mellower than the stockhaar (stock coat). Of course this is a percentage, not all. The same is true in at least some other breeds. The Dachshund comes to mind. The Belgian Shepherds. Hasn't anyone else noticed that Groenendaels and Tervurens are generally mellower than Malinois? In Collies it is less distinct. And I'm afraid I have has very little experience with smooth Border Collies, so will have to take your word on it.
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Re: A Dumb Question on Working vs. Show lines
[Re: Joy van Veen ]
#258669 - 12/05/2009 03:58 PM |
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Hey Joy, where did you come across enough Groenendaels to generalize anything? Lol.
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Re: A Dumb Question on Working vs. Show lines
[Re: Joy van Veen ]
#258673 - 12/05/2009 04:39 PM |
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"Hasn't anyone else noticed that Groenendaels and Tervurens are generally mellower than Malinois?" (Joy)
I know a lot of Mals in our club, at the local shelter, and one I fostered. Groenendaels and Tervurens are not thick on the ground where I live. I have met one Terv and maybe one Groenendael.
I know a lot more GSDs. The coat link to mellow personality isn't something I've heard of or seen, but I'm very interested in it. Is there a citation or link for more material?
Very interesting subject. 
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Re: A Dumb Question on Working vs. Show lines
[Re: steve strom ]
#258675 - 12/05/2009 04:41 PM |
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I have a plush coat white GSD and mellow is not a word to describe her. I also thought I heard that the white GSDs were supposed to be mellower in general so that is another gene to contend with in coat standard.
She is only 8 months (going on 9 months) so there is hope for mellow....
right now I want mellow, I am exhausted. (the picture is deceiving)
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Re: A Dumb Question on Working vs. Show lines
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#258680 - 12/05/2009 05:03 PM |
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I know a lot more GSDs. The coat link to mellow personality is not something I've heard of or seen, but I'm very interested in this. Is there a citation or link for more material?.
The first piece I heard about linking genes outside of hearsay was in a NGC In the Womb series which talks about how certain genes link to temperament specifically they were chatting about the liver gene.
The second link I heard about was in the russian silver fox project where they selected silver foxes at a fur farm based upon temperament alone. The resulting generations produced dog like foxes with traditional dog color patterns (spotted coats with a blaze and socks), floppy ears, barking, tail wagging, and absolutely ruined the coat for fur production. It was my first piece of concrete in my mind that perhaps temperament was a bit more set than I had previously thought by nature as opposed to nurture. It does stand to reason however that if traits on canids change via selection by temperament that perhaps temperament traits change via selection for other traits.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDb27ZP9zEE&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=enrLSfxTqZ0&feature=related
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Re: A Dumb Question on Working vs. Show lines
[Re: Marcia Blum ]
#258681 - 12/05/2009 05:04 PM |
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Re: A Dumb Question on Working vs. Show lines
[Re: Melissa Thom ]
#258684 - 12/05/2009 05:16 PM |
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Melissa,
I thought I garbled that study badly enough, but you did a much better job!
Is there anywhere you come down in this discussion?
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Re: A Dumb Question on Working vs. Show lines
[Re: Melissa Thom ]
#258685 - 12/05/2009 05:18 PM |
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... The second link I heard about was in the russian silver fox project where they selected silver foxes at a fur farm based upon temperament alone. The resulting generations produced dog like foxes with traditional dog color patterns (spotted coats with a blaze and socks), floppy ears, barking, tail wagging, and absolutely ruined the coat for fur production. It was my first piece of concrete in my mind that perhaps temperament was a bit more set than I had previously thought by nature as opposed to nurture.
I had forgotten about that fox project (and failed to make the valid connection anyway).
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