Quote:

Originally posted by Shelley J.A. Fritzke:
Probably in reality a dog with a longer , thick double coat would be easier to find the tick before it actually could bore into the skin!

Not according to a Keeshond owner I have talked with <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> . That's about the thickest double coat you can find.

I have a coated Shepherd. She has limited registration so any litters she had could not be registered. But no I'm not going to breed her, in fact she is spayed. It against standard so she is not breed worthy, I dont care if people will buy them or not.

She is a working dog, SAR. and a fantastic one at that. The coat is a detriment in some cases, she gets alots of burs and they can hinder her perfomance, not to mention the hours it takes me to get them out. She has a true undercoat and her does not part down the middle.

I like the coated dogs and for what I do it doesn't matter what the dog looks like as long as it can work. In fact we have three coats in my SAR unit, all great workers.

So all in all not much to contribute to the conversation except a personal anectdote. Yes I like them, and I could care less if they are disqualified from showing. When I start a breeding program, one day int he way fiture,no they wont be included. No point breeding against standard.

That was a pretty long haired GSD, I like to own one, but would not breed it to another long haired GSD, wanting to maintain the standard. But the only fault I read about regarding hair is no white or blue colored dogs?? Is this just AKC? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Supposedly there are two types of long coats...one with at least partial undercoat (Langstockhaar)and one with none. You will find many of them in LE work, especially overseas, because they are less expensive that "stockhaar" / normal coated dogs, since they cannot even be korklassed in he SV. The ones with no undercoat will typically have the hair on the back "part" down the middle like a Collie. I can well imagine what a mess one would be in snow country, but they actually handle heat about as well as any others. They absolutely are a PITA to check for ticks, and skin conditions, etc. as well as to get a prong collar on correctly.

Interestingly, good GSD breeders have pretty well bred out the white coat gene, but are seemingly unable to do so with the longcoat gene.

All the standards say what the coat should be, not necessarilly what it shouldn't. The standard would be a little long.

i am with you brad i love the long coat and i can tell you personally, because i have both, my standard gsd sheds alot more, like all year long in fact, her coat is so much thicker that if she had a tick, i couldn't find it. her fur is thick enough that just parting it is difficult. now my long coated gsd is alot easier and faster to brush, sheds alot less, toloerates the cold weather as good as my other one, and because her fur is thinner, without the undercoat, i find ticks on her much easier. and i have had my share this summer/fall. but yes she does get snow in between her toes, but it doesn't bother her the least. i am very opinionated about this, but the coated sheperd is more beautiful than the standard shepherd and i am not going to breed or compete with mine but it isn't because of the long hair either. anyway, i agree with brad 100% for bringing up some very good points.

:rolleyes: In response to the post that mentioned long hair GSD'S would not do well in SAR, Trackin, and Herding. I can only tell you that they use Goldens, in SAR,Tracking, and as Drug Dogs, I personally don't think that their long coat has anything to do with the ability to get the job done.

Please know that I have three GSD'S and I am not a Golden owner, I've just seen them do a lot of good work.

Just MHO, Joyce M. Burrows <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

This is getting stupid.

The correct coat is better than the long coat for reasons mentioned. It doesn't make the dog unable to do SAR or any other work, it just makes it more difficult to deal with, again, for reasons mentioned.

I don't think anybody has said they can't work, that is not the question. If you had to say one coat is better than the other for practical reasons the answer is simple. . .the correct coat is better, period.

BUT, it doesn't really matter unless you are breeding the dog. THAT is where I disagree with Brad and others. There is absolutely no reason to breed them. NONE, unless you like the way they look. . .and if that is the case you are messing up anyway, cuz you should be breeding a dog because of how it works and against the breed standard.

It doesn't matter to me either way. Anyone that knows me knows I believe in working only, period.

Anything that crosses the line too much for the standard I feel should be left too. Maybe this is one of them?

My question is why now is this coming up, how come through the last hundred years was this not addressed?

I just think with all the show, sport only dogs out there in working dog community there's bigger fish to fry, that's all.

VC, Well put and I'm with you 100%

Brad, it has been addressed over the past 100 yrs, 8x to be exact. You're right, there are bigger fish to fry, especially since the standard specifically addresses the issue of longcoats and long-stockcoats.

From the
WUSV/FCI Standard:

Coat

Coat Characteristics
The correct coat for the German Shepherd is a stock coat (outer and under coat). The top coat should be as tight as possible, straight, coarse, and clinging closely to the undercoat. The head, including the inside of the ears, the front of the legs, the paws, and toes have short hair. Neck hair is longer and thicker. On the rear side of the legs, hair length increases downward to the pastern and hock. The rear of the thighs is covered show moderate "pants".

Disqualifying Faults

j) White coat (incl. those with dark eyes and nails);
k) Long stock coat (long, soft loosely fitting outer coat with undercoat, flags on ears and legs, bushy pants and bushy tail with flag on underside);
l) Long coat (long, soft outer coat without undercoat). This coat type frequently is parted along the center line of the back, has flags on ears, legs, and tail.

Lets move on.