Quote: willie tilton

Thanks for the clarification Dave, I didn't get that from your post.
It sounded to me like you were telling her to use a prong..I must have missed the last sentence...

Koehler advocated hanging dogs regularly...As I understand it, the Dominant dog collar is used in seldom and specific instances usually involving Handler aggression. (Or as a back up for a prong).

If a person used a dom dog collar regularly for training, (not talking about as a passive back up here, but for hanging or taking away air) then I think they would be using a method of Koehler's....I should know, I used to train that way.

I wasn't saying anything about you.......just that the dog didn't do anything to warrant the dom dog collar, and to use it regularly in this case would be "Koehlerish"...is that even a word? lol

Ah Understood.

I never have in my life used a dom dog collar by itself. It is used with a Prong for safety in case my prong breaks. I have never seen this happen, but I have read about it enough that it scared me into buying one just in case.

The same goes for my quick release prong and with a 1 1/2 flat. The flat is there in case like today, I have to get the prong off fast to avoid hurting the dog with the prong, or possible chocking the dog out.

I have never starved a dog for air, or chocked him out. That to me is abusive, destructive behavior.

All my dogs once they know a command is lightly corrected for not doing it and treat/toy rewarded for doing it.
If to much correction is needed. I then stop correcting, go back to the house and work with 100% positive treat training in my living room until I think the dog has it.

I have been working with 100% positive training with my puppy though, that I have had since he was 8 weeks and now is 12 weeks. I would like to never have to use anything on him but a flat. I am moving very slow with him as I am learning as he does.
In a months time all we have done is sit, down, shake hands and come. All 100% positive training and all in my living room.

On walks we use a harness and they are stress free walks no commands.

You've never had to lift a dog off the bite in all your bitework?

Hi guys,
thanks so much, this really helps. Willie, the way I was taught to teach "focus" is to take a treat and track it from the dog's nose to my eyes and slowly fade the prompt. Correct? or no? Most of the stuff I was taught was obviously wrong so I am asking.
And as far as the speed, no, I don't think what you are saying is too slow. I think that they just need to be solid on certain things. It's like school. Nowadays they don't get them solid on simple arithmetics and you got a generation that can't give change at the register. So that's how I look at it. I just needed the timetable for it which you gave me and I am eternally grateful. See I am really good at knowing the timeframe for kids. For some reason my brain can't translate it to dogs.

Willie,
the videos I got are:
Your Puppy 8 Weeks to 8 Months
Basic Dog Obedience
Clicker Train Your Own Assistance Dog
Remote Collar Training for the Pet Owner
Should I get the marker training one? If you think I should I will.

Lenka, I do think you would get tons and tons out of it.
It is excellent.
I also think that the pack leader one is a good idea ..they have them packaged as a bundle.

 Quote:

You've never had to lift a dog off the bite in all your bitework?

Aaron: excellent point!!!!
Any trainer who has done a significant amount of bite work knows this.
I had not brought it up in my post as this was a pet situation, but I should have.
I know that lots of people read these posts that don't comment, and my comments could have been misleading.
Thank you.

Willie,
how about the "focus" from my previous question? Is it correct? thanks

I'm not answering for Willie, Lenka, but I do it slightly different. I fill my mouth with hotdog pieces and make an obvious movement feeding them from there and also spitting them when they have the idea of where they are.

Lenka,

Of course, I understand and glad you do ask questions. I am sorry if I came a little harsh on you. I was feeling sorry for the dog who had to deal that.

Everyone shares their own mistakes include me too. About seven to eight years ago, I used a lot of koehler methods, and was stupid enough to use a prong collar on one of my older dogs who is now deceased. We had issues with him barking at everything and being nervous. His eyes would glow. You could tell how stressed he was around people.

It took me a long time to realize that he was insecure around people so used DD and a prong collar make him a million worse. I gave up using a DD and a prong collar and let him feel that way until he was put to sleep from kidney problem. I look back I wish I had done more of positive and desensitize training.

I was surprised that you used a DD and a prong collar on your dog. I'm sure you didn't want to end up with a dog like one of my dogs did.

You have gotten many good suggestions by other people in here. Especially with Steve, Willie, Lynne, and others. I would still look for a good trainer or a behaviorist who could assist you with some things. When you get this under control with your dog, it will help to boost up her confident by doing OB, rally, agility, or flyball. That is way later.

No problem. It's just that I have a rather complicated life and I really want to keep the dogs. I have looked for help for many years and ended up with a mess. I found Leerburg by accident when I was getting something else off Amazon and one of the reviewers mentioned Leerburg in his review. It's at a point that if things don't get straightened out we will have to give them up. So in desperation I tried things I should not have. I am happy I am here and finally I feel like we are going to make it. BTW the prong was the older dog's and I just tried to put it on her to see how she would react. She did not like it so I never used it.

That's an excellent idea, thanks!