 Re: If the dog chose ....
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#385311 - 10/27/2013 04:56 PM |
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"i believe (and i might be wrong of course) that the dogs are projecting whatever they're born with."
So do I.
We're the ones with the big brains. We're the ones capable of self-evaluation, self-reflection, and self-directed change.
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Re: If the dog chose ....
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#385312 - 10/27/2013 05:03 PM |
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Natalie, you're very fixated on what people and dogs are born with, and this mindset does you no favors.
No dog is born knowing how to be a good house dog.
No person is born knowing how to interact with a dog.
These are skills that both species learn. Dogs and people learn in different ways.
Understanding the specific postures, gestures, behaviors that any dog in the world would recognize as "leadership" is the basis of all human-dog interaction. Ed covers this territory quite thoroughly.
Cinco | Jack | Fanny | Ellie | Chip | Deacon |
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Re: If the dog chose ....
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#385313 - 10/27/2013 05:07 PM |
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"Understanding the specific postures, gestures, behaviors that any dog in the world would recognize as "leadership" is the basis of all human-dog interaction. Ed covers this territory quite thoroughly."
And as Tracy also said, "You can read all the theory you want. But if you want to understand how to do it yourself, you listen to somebody that already demonstrates success. And learn from their experience."
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Re: If the dog chose ....
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#385314 - 10/27/2013 05:13 PM |
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where am i saying that i believe dogs are born knowing how to be house dogs and that people are born knowing how to interact with dogs?
and i'm not fixated on anything. just because i think about something doesn't mean i'm fixated on it. i think about a lot of things and i like being able to talk about them online.
if i can't do that without having wars break out then i will stop.
as far as Ed, i was only arguing one part of his article, that a dog can sense a leader and that a leader projects a leader attitude. to me that meant a leader among people which most people aren't.
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Re: If the dog chose ....
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#385315 - 10/27/2013 05:08 PM |
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"Understanding the specific postures, gestures, behaviors that any dog in the world would recognize as "leadership" is the basis of all human-dog interaction. Ed covers this territory quite thoroughly."
And as Tracy also said, "You can read all the theory you want. But if you want to understand how to do it yourself, you listen to somebody that already demonstrates success. And learn from their experience."
that's exactly what i'm doing.
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Re: If the dog chose ....
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#385316 - 10/27/2013 05:17 PM |
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"Me: How does one dog project rank (leadership status) to another?
You: i believe (and i might be wrong of course) that the dogs are projecting whatever they're born with."
Who cares what they are born with? My point is do you know what you have to learn to do to project rank to your dog? You just keep repeating that you have to be a born leader. And I'm trying to say that it's a pretty short list of things that a motivated child can learn.
Cinco | Jack | Fanny | Ellie | Chip | Deacon |
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Re: If the dog chose ....
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#385317 - 10/27/2013 05:23 PM |
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i misunderstood your question.
what i've been saying all along is that i don't think you have to be a leader (and that leaders are born therefore you can't become one) at all to be able to have a well behaved dog.
so if anyone is fixated on anything then it's you guys about being a leader.
ETA i also don't think we have to learn how to project anything to our dog. it's all about setting rules and training the dogs.
ok, so i manage to project that i'm #1. what changes?
he will stop pulling? he will stop climbing on my bed or going crazy when i come home?
maybe he will learn to sit and heel?
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Re: If the dog chose ....
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#385318 - 10/27/2013 05:28 PM |
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Nothing changes.
"You can read all the theory you want. But if you want to understand how to do it yourself, you listen to somebody that already demonstrates success. And learn from their experience."
But nothing changes until you go do it. Do what you've learned.
If you don't understand a chunk, you carry on anyway. Experience will bring a ton of understanding.
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Re: If the dog chose ....
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#385319 - 10/27/2013 05:29 PM |
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I'm currently raising my fourth German Shepherd - got my first at age 20 and I am now 32. I've had dogs my entire life, but only the last three (four if you count the pup) have had formal training.
I have LEARNED to be a better leader with each dog. I get better and better at leading. I get better and better at training. My dogs get better and better. Because I am a better leader and trainer, my dogs and I form stronger partnerships.
You say people have to born leaders.
I was the shyest kid, the one who lived in fear of being noticed. I was not a leader. Today, I'm involved in education. I teach my students. I train staff. I work with parents. I lead. Anyone who knew me as a kid cannot believe I can easily stand up in front of a group of 50 teachers and present a training. I grew, I changed, I listened, I learned...and I continue to do so.
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Re: If the dog chose ....
[Re: Connie Sutherland ]
#385320 - 10/27/2013 05:30 PM |
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Nothing changes.
"You can read all the theory you want. But if you want to understand how to do it yourself, you listen to somebody that already demonstrates success. And learn from their experience."
But nothing changes until you go do it. Do what you've learned.
If you don't understand a chunk, you carry on anyway. Experience will bring a ton of understanding.
i do. i definitely don't halt everything until i understand a chunk. i disregarded the leadership part because i didn't agree with it but used everything else from his articles that i did agree with.
today i just felt like bringing it up, i like a good discussion. i see now that this is not the place for it. all my threads become personal attacks at some point.
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